robselantra, have you seen anyone in this thread that is nearby your location? Which major street corner are you nearest?

A couple of mentions of my area, but for mounts in attics mostly, and one for the CM Stealth antenna. I'm close to March/Shirleys Brook, about a street back from that intersection.

I'm on Marchvale - a little closer to Carp than you, but overall a very similar TVFool map.

I'm getting all of the local channels with a pair of antennas in the attic. There's an old (giant) FM/VHF/UHF unit aimed at Camp Fortune that's been in the attic for 10+ years, and a new DB4E UHF antenna aimed at Herbert's Corners. They get combined in a CM7777 pre-amp.

With a single good UHF outdoor antenna such as a CM4228 aimed in the general direction of Herbert's Corners you should be able to get everything except Global - that model picks up VHF-HI (CBOFT on 9 and CJOH on 13) fairly well.

My neighbour has a CM4228 + CM7777 in his attic and gets everything except Global. If he fiddles with the antenna position he says he can get Global working, but that generally makes OMNI.1 on CH60.1 disappear - it seems to be the weakest of the Herbert's Corners channels. He'll probably end up getting a VHF-only antenna to aim at Camp Fortune and then combine them with the CM7777 like I'm doing.

Hopefully Global will eventually move off VHF-LO or at least put out a stronger signal, but I haven't seen anything to indicate that they've applied to do so.

In Kanata North I would lean towards a 4 bay (or a C2) antenna over a cm4228 as it will have a much wider beam-width and you will likely need a separate VHF antenna for global anyway.

Glad to see all of the info here on OTA. Just moved here from out West and have settled into our new house in Carp (Hidden Lake). The home theatre room is complete (120" front projection system) and the next step is getting OTA HDTV hopefully in time for the NHL playoffs. HD tuner is on order and will be here next week.

TVfool info: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d267e8023da53a6

I am higher up on the ridge, but the crest is between my house and the CF antennas.

So I am planning on putting together a SBGH antenna in the attic to pick up the local stations. Looks like for now at least, the US stations are trickier to pick up and I will leave that for another day. I may however, try to add a dipole antenna to pick up Global.

This may be a bit more technical question (and more for the antenna design forum??), but I think that the SBGH should pick up both towers as they are only about 70 degrees apart from where I am. Looks like it is best to cheat it towards the HC towers?? Also as this is going to be an attic install, I am not looking for weatherproofing the design so the elements will be on a large styrofoam board in the attic. The main question that I have is that most GH designs have the reflector poles, but in this situation, is it better to just have a flat mesh/solid reflector if there is no need to worry about weight/corrosion/wind?

Bit of an information overload going through these forums over the past few days (I have changed the design in my head a dozen times after reading the posts!), but I'm glad I found this resource.

Cheers!

Hi Poosh99 and welcome to Ottawa. I am also originally from out west (Abbotsford, BC to be exact) but have been here now for almost 20 years. :o

I agree that from your location the US stations will be tricky, especially with an attic install. You can play with it when you have some time to kill, but I wouldn't hold my breath on receiving them reliably.

I am not an expert on the SBGH, but it should be OK (certainly worth a try), and you are right, and you will want to cheat it towards the HC tower (probably pointing it either due west or maybe a bit north). To get things going for the playoffs, you may need/want to temporarily sacrifice CITY and the OMNIs to ensure reliable reception from CBOT (last thing you want is to lose reception in overtime), and then play with it a bit more after the playoffs are over.

Global will be tough for you with an attic install (I would subtract about 40dB from the NM, 20dB for it being VHF-LO and 20dB for the Attic install). You can try a dipole, but you may need something a bit bigger. CJOH is very strong and should be easy to pull in with pretty much any antenna.

As for your question about the GH reflector poles, once again I am not an expert, but I gather the main reason people use them is for VHF-HI reception, but if you have a separate VHF antenna, any type of reflector should do.

One other station to look at receiving eventually is CKWS on 36. It is an analog CBC affiliate, but will often show a different hockey game than CBOT. It is another 80 degrees from HC (155 degrees from CF).

Hi Poosh99.

I'm also in Hidden Lake. I've done some experimentation in my living room, with a Silver Sensor and channel 6 dipole joined with a UVSJ, and the Camp Fortune channels come in quite reliably, including Global. I wasn't able to get Global at all without the dipole.
I've got another house between me and Herberts Corners, so I've only been able to pick some of them up, but it's very finicky aiming.
CKWS comes in quite well, if I aim my antenna toward it.
As for WNPI, I haven't seen a picture yet, but I've seen a non-zero signal level, which means there's some signal making it this way.

I suggest you try to do a tvfool report using your coordinates, instead of postal code, for more accurate numbers. If you look at my tvfool report (it's my homepage on my profile), which should be similar to yours, the signal levels from Herbert's Corners are lower, but WNPI is higher.

I get a Noise Margin of -7.3 for WNPI, compared to -11.7 from the report you posted.

I've got a Winegard HD8800 a CM 7777 preamp.

Gain at ch 23 = 14.5dB
Amp Noise = -2.0 dB
Best Case = 12.5 dB

12.5 - 7.3 leaves 5.2dB of margin to overcome the loss from the roof. That's the tricky part, because the loss due to the attic is hard to estimate. No one knows until they try.

I'm going to give a try. I just haven't had a chance to get up into the attic yet. I suspect I'll be able to pick up the Herberts Corners stations much more easily, and I'll see how reliable PBS is.

If I can't get PBS that way, I'll have some motivation to set up my satellite dish. The PBS HD programming from available FTA, and I think WNPI just re-transmits that for the HD subchannel 18-3. But that discussion's for another forum.

Good luck, and let us know how you do.

Once I get up in the attic, I'll post my results, and you'll likely have a better sense of what you can reasonably get.

I am aware that there are two main towers (one in "Camp Fortune" in Gatineau and another in Manotick). I'd like to get all the channels available from these towers including PBS and CBS if possible from the states.

I was wondering if I could get all those channels with a round "flying saucer" like omni directional antenna (the CM Smartenna CM 3000 comes to mind)?

Or perhaps two Antennas Direct DB4E or CM 4228HD antennas?

Connected with a coupler and a pre-amp?

Here is what the TVFOOL tool gave me as a result of my channel search:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3dde65ed0b8d47b7

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

bigred78, what has changed since Post #578?

BigRed,

Welcome to the forum. Winter is over. You're settled in the new house. Time to do the OTA.

Your location appears hopeful for a couple of American channels for you. But there would be no hope with a flying saucer antennas. If you want to maximize your chances you will need a roof-level outdoor antenna pointed right at those NY channels.

I might choose the Winegard 8-bay antenna as my first attempt. And a pre-amp. I might try to find an Antennacraft 10g201 pre-amp as a first choice. Otherwise maybe a Winegard 269, or Channel Master 7778.

Wait for advice from a local because they have real-world experience in Ottawa. But I think this set-up would maximize your chances for US reception.

The flying saucer willl probably work for you for all your locals if you don't care about the US channels. Global might not come in right away, but it will up its signal on a new frequency in a few months so keep scanning and eventually it will show up.

Good luck and report your results here.

Hi bigred78,

I'm in the same neighbourhood as you and have had good success with my homemade antenna, built to Mclapp 9.5 x 9 specs.

The one deviation I've made from the specs is that my bowtie lengths are only 9 inches long instead of 9.5 - simply because this was my first attempt and I was trying to build it as inexpensively as possible so I used coathangers for the bowties and was limited in wire length because of that. I also do not have a reflector installed on it. This antenna is giving me good reception of all local UHF channels when placed in my first floor living room. My next step is to install it permanently in my attic.

To receive Global, I have built a folded dipole out of 1/2 inch flexible copper tubing left over from a gas fireplace install. It's big - about 168 cm wide and 15 cm high, but it works to pull in Global, again from the living room. This too will be moving to the attic soon. Interestingly, this antenna also pulls in most of the local UHF channels too.

The challenge I'm having right now is trying to find a UVSJ in Ottawa so I can join the two antennae together. If anyone knows of a local supplier I'd love to hear about it. I can find them online in the US for a few bucks, but hate to think what I might pay in shipping etc.

We've discussed this previously on the Ontario spplier forum. You can find a USVJ for around $20 in town.

Note that Global will mostly likely be on channel 14 within a year, and SRC wil move to 33, leaving only CJOH on VHF.

Also note that WWNY-7 Watertown has applied to increase power slightly from 24 kW to 42 kW.

Global on 14 takes away our only chance to get WPTZ.

But then of course people out of town won't have to worry if Global continues to broadcast in mw.

-gmd

But then of course people out of town won't have to worry if Global continues to broadcast in mw.
-gmd
What is "mw"?

Global on 14 takes away our only chance to get WPTZ.

As discussed elsewhere, ever since WPTZ moved to Mount Mansfield (in VT), the signal has been blocked from any parts of Ottaw by a mountain. It could affect those east if Ottawa (ex Alexandria or Hawksburry) though.

mW = milli watts

(I get WPBS more reliably than CIII, but interference from FM stations could be partly to blame)

Seriously, who in Hawkesbury or Alexandria points their antenna towards the West when Mount Mansfield comes in nice and clear? I grew up watching those stations in Hawkesbury... Good ol' Dukes of Hazzard on a 13" black and white.

I got WPTZ a few times in Blackburn since OMNI2 shut down its analog signal.

I think you forgot the smiley. Global's ERP on channel 6 in the deepest null towards Orleans is still 70 Watts, or 70,000 mW.

gmd, Global on 14 won't be in mW. See OTA Station Status: Ottawa, Watertown NY, S. Colton NY (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?p=1407955#post1407955) for the technical parameters.

The biggest source of problems receiving Global on channel 6 is impulse noise. This is not a factor on UHF however.

Once Global is off 6, we can start to think about FM reception. :)

So many channels (50 to be precise), yet everything around Ottawa seem to converge towards the same ones used relatively close by.

Global on 14... how about 16? We've never seen anything on 16 since WPBS left for 41... It is true that Global does not try to extend their reach all the way to Montréal. They were on channel 6 with CBMT after all.

Speaking of 41, CIII-SD shows up as 41-2... We're getting used to this... just an idea... :)

Back on CBMT, on the rare occasions where its signal is strong enough, it confuses a lot of tuners (two 6-1s). CBMT and WWTI on 21 can mix things up, too.

I think the CRTC never heard of a rotor (nor a booster). :)

So many channels (50 to be precise), yet everything around Ottawa seem to converge towards the same ones used relatively close by.

Industry Canada is limited as to which channels may be used by the agreement they have with the FCC. I gather that agreement was made before it was decided to auction off the 700MHz band and this region had more than their share of channels in that band. Also, as we have discovered, channels 2-6 are basically unusable for DTV and 7-13 require more power than initially anticipated. Then there is the international treaty that prohibits the use of channel 37. Now the FCC is planning on further reducing the UHF band in the next 10 years. When you take all of this into account, we are rapidly running out of channels.

Global on 14... how about 16? We've never seen anything on 16 since WPBS left for 41...

My guess is the FCC still owns 16 in this region. Even if that isn't the case, given that CITY is on 17 from HC, it would greatly limit the power that could be used from CF on 16 without interfering with too many people's ability to receive CITY.

As said many times before, American broadcasts are not protected in Canada and Canadian broadcasts are not protected in the United States, so it is perfectly acceptable for Global to interfere with your potential to receive WPTZ in Canada, even if you would otherwise be within its "protected contour".