City is almost 5 hours slow.Omni 2 is about 38 minutes slow and Omni 1 is about 16 minutes slow.What this means for me is I program out these stations from my PVR because it resets the clock and I miss recording shows.So wrong time means I dont watch these channels.

Agreed. I imagine what they learned from putting up the Toronto stations will be leveraged for the rest. Of course, they'll have incorrect time and placeholder-type program guide too. Not sure if "smooth" meant accurate time/program guide info. In that case, it won't be smooth. The guy I talked to at Rogers a couple of years said they'll be leaving it like that because there's no requirement to have accurate time/program guide info. When I checked with Industry Canada and the CRTC, I found out he was right.

Like everyone else, I hope they change their plans. I'm just not letting get my expectations get too large.
While having EIT table populated with real program data does not appear to be mandatory (just the existence of the entries is), accurate time is mandatory:

From A/65-2009 (I can't find a copy of A/65 Rev C right now). I've bolded the part that seems pretty clear to me:
system_time — A 32-bit unsigned integer quantity representing the current system time as the
number of GPS seconds since 00:00:00 UTC, 6 January 1980. The count of GPS seconds and
leap second count shall be accurate and correct to within plus or minus one second, for a direct
main broadcast signal RF receiving device, as timed at the arrival in the decoder of the
Transport Stream packet carrying the last byte of the CRC. The STT seconds count should be
set to the next second and sent approximately 2T milliseconds before the seconds count is due
to increment, where T represents the average number of milliseconds between TS packets
identified with the SI base_PID (0x1FFB). If one or more translators and/or repeaters are in the
RF delivery path that introduce processing delays that impact the overall STT timing accuracy,
the STT timing should be adjusted in the translated/repeated signal.

tvlurker, in addition to posting that here, perhaps you should argue this with the CRTC and/or Industry Canada. Even if you're correct (and I hope you are!), the DHC OTA forum cannot mandate anything to broadcasters - it has to come from CRTC/IC.

All I am saying is that's what they told me when I reported that some Toronto stations were supplying inaccurat System Time Table data. I'm sorry but I don't have the time or energy to pursue it vigorously.

It is nothing to contact the CRTC and make this known to them, but let the broadcaster know first I would think. Sounds like roger1818 has someone's ear over there regarding this so perhaps it can be done that way. It was him that requested the information after all.

Sounds like roger1818 has someone's ear over there regarding this so perhaps it can be done that way.

Re-read post #98 (http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=1170189&postcount=98). :) They are looking into the problem. Will provide updates as I receive them.

It is nothing to contact the CRTC and make this known to them, but let the broadcaster know first I would think. Sounds like roger1818 has someone's ear over there regarding this so perhaps it can be done that way. It was him that requested the information after all.
I've already emailed the Ottawa district office. We'll see what they say.

The CRTC doesn't really concern itself with technical matters, but I might try them, too.

CHMI Winnipeg

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/310/0/0/chmi_by_emeraldboar-d32aczi.png

For a copy: http://emeraldboar.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d32aczi
Al

CHNM1 Victoria

http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/310/b/a/chnm_by_emeraldboar-d32ad15.png

For a copy, http://emeraldboar.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d32ad15
Al

CJMT London (Omni)

http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/310/4/4/cjmt_by_emeraldboar-d32agau.png

For a Copy, http://emeraldboar.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d32agau
Al

CKEM Edmonton (City)

http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/311/a/2/ckem_by_emeraldboar-d32db93.png

For a copy, http://emeraldboar.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d32db93
Al

CKVU Vancouver (city)
CKVU1 Victoria (city) ** New Transmitter proposal.

http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/311/d/5/ckvu_by_emeraldboar-d32dbik.png

Instead of having one main transmitter to support both market. Roger is planning to setup 2 smaller broadcast towers.

For a copy,
http://emeraldboar.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d32dbik
Al

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2010/2010-822.htm

Broadcasting Decision CRTC 2010-822

PDF version

Route reference: 2010-69

Additional reference: 2010-720

Ottawa, 8 November 2010

Rogers Broadcasting Limited
Vancouver and Victoria, British Columbia

Application 2010-1430-8, received 30 August 2010
CKVU–TV Vancouver – Licence amendment

1. The Commission approves the application by Rogers Broadcasting Limited to amend the broadcasting licence for the television programming undertaking CKVU-TV Vancouver to add post-transition digital transmitters in order to serve the population of Vancouver and Victoria. The Commission did not receive any interventions in connection with this application.

2. The Vancouver transmitter will operate on channel 33 with an average effective radiated power (ERP) of 4,300 watts (maximum ERP of 8,300 watts with an effective height of antenna above average terrain (EHAAT) of 670 metres).

3. The Victoria transmitter will operate on channel 27 with an ERP of 1,647 watts (maximum ERP of 2,750 watts with an EHAAT of 99.6 meters).

4. In Revised licensing framework for over-the-air digital television services, Broadcasting Regulatory Policy CRTC 2010-69, 10 February 2010, the Commission stated that it would no longer issue separate licences for digital television transmitters. Instead, it would authorize the operation of digital transmitters by amending the existing licence so as to allow the simulcast of the associated service’s programming on a digital transmitter. In light of the Commission’s determinations set out in that policy, the Commission has considered this application as an amendment to the existing licence.

5. The Commission reminds the licensee that, pursuant to section 22(1) of the Broadcasting Act, this licence amendment will only be effective when the Department of Industry notifies the Commission that its technical requirements have been met and that a broadcasting certificate will be issued.

6. The transmitters must be operational at the earliest possible date and in any event no later than 31 August 2011. The Commission expects the licensee to inform it in writing once these transmitters are in operation.

Note bolded text below regarding CHNM's plan to transition (ie drop analog signal) early.

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2010/2010-823.htm

Broadcasting Decision CRTC 2010-823

PDF version

Route reference: 2010-69

Additional reference: 2010-319

Ottawa, 8 November 2010

Rogers Broadcasting Limited
Vancouver and Victoria, British Columbia

Application 2010-0037-2, received 15 January 2010
CHNM-TV Vancouver – Licence amendment

1. The Commission approves the application by Rogers Broadcasting Limited (Rogers) to amend the broadcasting licence for the television programming undertaking CHNM-TV Vancouver in order to add a post-transition digital transmitter in Victoria. The Commission did not receive any interventions in connection with this application.

2. In CHNM-DT Vancouver – New transmitter in Victoria, Broadcasting Decision CRTC 2006-289, 11 July 2006 (Broadcasting Decision 2006-289), the Commission approved an application to amend the broadcasting licence for the transitional digital television programming undertaking CHNM-DT Vancouver in order to operate a transmitter in Victoria to be known as CHNM-DT-1 on channel 54B with an average effective radiated power (ERP) of 78 watts. The transmitter approved in that decision is not in operation. Rogers is now requesting an amendment to the licence of CHNM-TV Vancouver in order to add a post-transition digital transmitter at Victoria to replace the transmitter approved in Broadcasting Decision 2006-289.

3. The new transmitter will operate on channel 29 with an average ERP of 1,647 watts (maximum ERP of 2,750 watts with an effective height of antenna above average terrain of 99.6 metres).

4. The Commission reminds the licensee that, pursuant to section 22(1) of the Broadcasting Act, the licence amendment will not be in effect until the Department of Industry notifies the Commission that its technical requirements have been met and that a broadcasting certificate will be issued.

5. The transmitter must be operational at the earliest possible date and in any event no later than 31 August 2011. The Commission expects the licensee to inform it in writing once this transmitter is in operation.

6. Further, given the approval of this application and at the licensee’s request, the authority granted in Broadcasting Decision 2006-289 is null and void as of the date of this decision.

7. The Commission notes that Rogers intends to cease operation of its analog transmitter CHNM-TV-1 upon commencement of the digital transmitter approved in this decision. The Commission expects Rogers to broadcast public service announcements during peak viewing periods so as to inform over-the-air viewers of the shut-down date for analog transmission and the steps to be taken to continue to receive the over-the-air signal.

Secretary General

*This decision is to be appended to the licence.

One RBL proposal was approved. But, Alas the .zip documents were unavailable when i checked. (Yesterdays .zips are good for leeching.)

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2010/2010-855.htm

CJCO-TV Calgary

Read ya l8r,
Al

Contour maps are generated by professional engineers for regulatory use and may not depict the actual viewing area of the station on all points of that map. Always check the Reception thread for your area for real world experiences.

CJCO Calgary

http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/324/8/f/cjco_by_emeraldboar-d338q03.png

According to Industry Canada's database, a post-transition transmitter for CITY (Toronto) has been approved on channel 44 at 21000 watts. This can be seen in stampeder's list here:

http://www.user.dccnet.com/jonleblanc/Canada_TV_Stations/DT.html

A second entry for CFMT in Ottawa has appeared in Industry Canada's database with the approved (AP) status. It is named CFMT-DT-2(2) and has the same parameters as the existing CFMT-DT-2. I guess this means that Rogers is not planning on increasing power after the transition.

The new entry can be seen in stampeder's list:

http://www.user.dccnet.com/jonleblanc/Canada_TV_Stations/DT.html

City on 44? I'm a little confused, according to their (Industry Canada's) full sheet, CJMT (OMNI2) is supposed to have 44 both current and future? City was supposed to be on 51.

ON Toronto OP 44 CJMT-DT INDE 433856 792254 314.3 15000 650.00
ON Toronto AL 44 CJMT-PT 433856 792254 303.7 1000000 650.00

ON Toronto OP 53 CITY-DT INDE 433833 792314 515.0 2000 704.00
ON Toronto AP 44 CITY-DT(1) 433833 792314 501.4 21000 650.00
ON Toronto AL 51 CITY-PT 433833 792314 463.3 23000 692.00

So where is OMNI2 moving to?

I asked my contact at Rogers about this (my previous response was based on something I read here), and he said that regarding the time of day, he will have someone look at the issue.

My contact at Rogers wrote back to me just now to say that the other day they installed an Evertz GPS clock system that provides NTP output and fed the NTP to all the HD encoders which seems to have locked them now to real time. Please let me know if you see an improvement. I am assuming this will fix all CITY and OMNI stations.

Time on CKAL-DT Citytv Calgary is still messed up. Currently displays as 6:27 a.m. When it's really 12:42 p.m.
Or was this fix just for Toronto?