: ON - Oakville, Burlington, Milton, Halton - OTA
2010-11-17, 04:01 PM
Anyone know what is the best cable lengths for the RG6 from the splitter to each antenna? With two different antennas the 4221 and 4228 should they still be equal length?
With respect to Goforit, I disagree. Not equal lenths for combining 2 different antennas. The trick with combining a 4221 with a 4228 is to compensate for the feed harness that joins the 2 stacks together on the 4228.
When I did that, I experimented, cutting the cable shorter by 1 inch at a time and trying again. Once it was obvious i went past the peak, I backed up by 2 inches.
I didn't write down any of my measurements or lengths, but I think it was somewhere around 8-9 inches longer on the cable to the 4221, that gives enough delay in the signal to match phase, about equal to the delay in the combiner feed harness on the 4228.
2010-11-17, 05:11 PM
A friend of mine wants to go OTA, but wants to get the Buffalo DTV stations. The TVFool results are here (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d81a3a1f15b7f58). I'm expecting (based on the TVFool results) that the Canadian locals will come in fine even if the antenna is pointed at Buffalo. The planned installation is going to be about 25' high, and should clear the rooftops. Towards the US transmitters, the antenna should have a clear view of the horizon.
I'm curious what gear others in the area are using. My plan was to get a CM4228HD and a Titan 7777 preamp. Does anyone have any other recommendations or any thoughts about if this will get the job done? Also, forgive me in advance for not reading the complete history of the thread -- I'm being lazy and just asking.
The single biggest thing I learned about OTA is that you won't know until you try.... but here are my nooby thoughts:
-Your channels are about 125 degrees apart (173 - 48) This is wide for the 4228 as the sensitivity drops after a spread of 90 degrees. see here (http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4228.html)
-If you point at Buffalo, the side of the antenna will need to pick up the local stations. You may not be able to get the Hamilton stations and the Toronto stations, but you could try to bias it toward Toronto or Hamilton.
-I think you may be better off with two antennas, One pointed at Toronto and one pointed at Buffalo.
I have a DB-8 antenna (very similar to 4228, but has greater side sensitivity (http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/DB8.html)) and my stations are 81 degrees apart. My antenna is about 35' high, and pointed south east to Buffalo. I get 25 channels and added a distribution amp when I went to 4 devices.
2010-11-17, 05:49 PM
Thanks for your feedback, Frank. Are you close (or are you're results similar) to the ones I posted?
2010-11-17, 06:09 PM
Thanks for your feedback, Frank. Are you close (or are you're results similar) to the ones I posted?I am in Halton Hills / Georgetown, so not very close and results are different.
Here is a link to my TVfool: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3dcef33c623bf190
2010-11-17, 06:32 PM
Is there a best time of year for reception? I've noticed that a couple of weeks ago things were much better for me.My understanding is that fall is the best time to set up OTA as this will give us the minimum number of stations.
When the warmer weather arrives we get more stations. I guess a little humidity helps in signal propagation.
2010-11-17, 06:49 PM
I live in a condo in Bronte (near Bronte and Lakeshore). My location is a poor choice for OTA as I live near highrise buildings and have high trees between my townhouse and the lake. I tried a Terk antenna on my main floor with almost no reception last summer. Today I tried it on the second floor and was able to get a few Buffalo stations and CHCH in HD.
Would a better antenna in the attic improve these results?
Is there any hope of getting CBC in HD? (I can get it in very snowy SD on the Terk)
My TV Fool (http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d81a3d216739ee1).
I would like to ditch Cogeco as I can get almost everything we watch over the internet except local news and CBC HNC.
2010-11-17, 07:11 PM
Awesome. So I guess it is safe assumption that the DTV stations from Buffalo will be reliable then -- thanks for the feedback!
2010-11-17, 07:22 PM
We have the Channel Master 4228 antenna. No Pre-amp until now and today I installed a Channel Master 7778 pre-amp. We're at Winston Churchill/403 and I put it on to get a better reception of 7.2 and CITY-TV. What happened was my results are WORSE!!!
I put on the 7778 because I was afraid the 7777 would blow out my TV's. We have a 32" and a 40" HD plus a 27" analogue all fed by the same antenna.
The antenna is directed to Buffalo and I"m picking up CTV/CITY/CBC on one sidelobe and CH on another sidelobe. Should I switch to the 7777?
If so, do I have to replace both components, or just the one that plugs into the power supply?
2010-11-17, 07:56 PM
I'm not sure. When I put in London, Ont into TVFool it doesn't show any US stations. (Maybe your location has changed??)
2010-11-17, 07:57 PM
Digital Frank, what kind of distribution amp are you using?
2010-11-17, 08:06 PM
I am no expert, but with CBC only 23 miles away I think if you could get the antenna higher (including attic), you just may get it in CBC in HD.
What model antenna do you have?
What happens if you have the antenna hooked to only 1 TV, do you still have problems getting WKBW and CITY?
If you can get one TV to work OK, then you have enough signal strength and a distribution amp should fix the problem.
I use a Channel Master 3414 (1 in, 4 out) when I hooked up additional TVs and TV tuner. (BTW: It looks like the 3414 does not amplify all frequencies equally. In looking at before an after results, it amplified the weaker signals more than the stronger ones. I guess this prevents signal distortion)
As the great people from save and replay old me "only use 1 TV to align the antenna and record your results. Then add a second TV and record the results". In my case, when I added the second TV, some stations were gone due to the 3.5 db loss of the splitter. The CM3414 fixed that.
BTW, CITY TV only uses 2200 watts to transmit the signal, which is not very much and is the lowest powered station that I know of.
2010-11-17, 08:57 PM
I only have a Terk right now and am wondering if a better one in the attic will suffice. I think the highrise buildings towards Toronto are going to be the issue. I cannot pick up anything other than a snowy CBC in SD.
2010-11-17, 09:34 PM
Any idea what model of Turk?
2010-11-17, 10:25 PM
You are correct. I live in London and there are (save tropo) most certainly no US DTV stations. However, I'm posting here because I'm going to help a friend who lives in Burlington set up a rig -- those were the TVFool results I posted originally in post 800 (http://digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=1180569&postcount=800) of this thread. Sorry if I was unclear -- I'm looking for guidance to get the US stations from Buffalo in Burlington, but from what I gather, it shouldn't be too hard.
2010-11-17, 10:42 PM
When we originally hooked up our 32" LCD, we did have 7.2 (WKBW's movie station). 7.1 comes in fine, so it confuses me that 7.2 does not. We then hooked up our analogue TV and lost 7.2. CITY was pretty much the same way. When we bought our 40" LCD, we never could get CITY nor can we get Global's digital output on the new one, but still get it on the 32". Mind you the 32" is significantly closer to the splitter and antenna. I hoped that by installing the 7778, we could get those channels back. The result is actually worse! I'm losing CBS now, and I do enjoy my CBS programming.
I know about CITY's low power. That's what happens when a cable company owns a TV station. They want to reap the cable income rather than put it OTA for free!
I'll have to find one of those splitters PDQ now as the colder weather will mean ice on my roof very soon!
2010-11-17, 11:06 PM
Ahhhhh, I see. You should not have any problem getting US stations in Burlington.
2010-11-17, 11:11 PM
Excellent news! You people in the GTA are lucky!
2010-11-18, 03:11 PM
WIVB's been on low power for a couple of weeks now. Technical problems. It will be back.
7.2 is not a sub channel of WKBW. It's actually WNGS 67.1/2/3 (real channel 7). It's not generally receivable in the GTA. Last weekend we had exceptional tropo conditions.
GLOBAL and CITY are notoriously low powered stations. If I aim too much towards Buffalo they're the first to go. Using splitters will only exacerbate the situation. Try a direct connection from the antenna to just one TV as a baseline, then gradually add splitters for the other sets. It will give you a better handle on your power requirements. It's possible a quality distribution amp is a better choice for you than a pre-amp.
2010-11-18, 08:24 PM
Any idea what model of Turk?
Not sure of the model but it is a Terk indoor antenna with "Terk HDTVa" on the base.
2010-11-19, 12:21 AM
Thanks guys, I got rid of my pre-amp and bought a distribution amp. I actually see no real difference yet. Over the summer, during extremely hazy times, I lost a lot of the U.S. signals, and I hoped to avoid that in the future.
The Distribution Amp I installed seems to not hurt the transmission, so I'll keep it. In the meantime, I have about 30' of RG6 between this distribution amp and a splitter that feeds our 40" and our 27" analogue. Is it ok to install a second distribution amp in lieu of the splitter currently in place? That would be difficult to do as it's behind a baseboard and no power supply in that area, but I'm looking at options.