Goforit:

Newbie to newbie, I likely know less than you do.

Playing around on Google World I did note however that your ground elevation at Upper Kennilworth and Limeridge is 367.4' while Buffalo is 623.3' good so far. Panning along your line of sight however you face a 682' elevation where it crosses the Parkway between Mud and Highland. This is close enough to you that it affects all Buffalo and Syracuse Stations. The lowest masthead is over 900 feet for these stations so you should also have a clean shot.

At 58 miles I am only five miles further to Buffalo than you are with ground elevation of 450'. My L.of S. is however over water around Hamilton Mountain so I have a straight shot at both CN Tower and all Buffalo and Grand Island stations.

With my CM 4228 and CM Rotor, no pre-amp, antenna mast mounted with the top element at 18' above ground, well under neighbouring rooflines, I get consistently great reception on the following:

2.1
2.2
4.1
5.1
7.1
7.2
9 (cannot get 9.1 to scan in)
11.1
17
17.1
17.2
17.3
19
23.1
25.1
29
44.1
47
49.1

As I have kept XpressVu to get my Habs games on RDS, I'm happy with that.

Hope this will help you, and that some knowledgeable member will give me a clue with my CTV scanning problem.

Bob:p

Hey Bob:

Thanks for the info. I think I might be a further away from the southern BUF towers than 60 miles.

I think for not having a rotor, I got pretty good results. If anyone can give me a clue on the relationship between signal strength of BUF analogue vs. digital I would appreciate it. It's also neat that I can pick up VHF channels with a UHF antenna, 4221. The one mistake I made so far, is not checking with the wife on where I put the 2 antennas, I like the look, much smaller than the giant VHF antennas I grew up with. She kinda flipped, OK she royally flipped and I now I’m going to move the antennas. It’s not too bad because I will probably mount it higher, near the back of the house, over the roof line, and get the 4228 for BUF with a rotor, and still have a 4221 for TOR. I know my stations would come in much better if I had the rotor. Even in analogue (with the 4221) the picture on my tube TV ($300 Samsung 27 inch) was awesome, much better than cable- caught a little bit of an NFL game and the picture quality was super clear on channel 57- seemed like digital or even HD.

I will eventually buy a 40-50" plasma/lcd with the atsc rec.

Cheers!

Hey Q:

That's some mighty fine results with the 4221. I'm on the other side of the lake- Hamilton East Mtn. and have two 4221s- one for the CN tower and one for BUF- mounted outside above roof line. All my TOR channels (analog though) come in perfect, 100%. The BUF channels (analog again) on UHF are good to fair. I would really apprecite it if you could provide some insight on analog vs. digital BUF with the 4221. I will eventually get my digital TV/receiver- and try to get the BUF digital channels. Do you think I should be fine with the 4221 or should I upgrade to the 4228? Also, how much of a difference will the pre-amp make for the 4221 or 4228? I rather not get the 4228 since I alreay have two 4221s.

Thank you.

goforit, the Oakville, Mississauga, Brampton area is the best possible place in Canada to get the Buffalo stations because of the broadcast patterns of the Buffalo transmitters. People in those Canadian areas are very fortunate.

Your area on the East Mountain, unfortunately, is not as lucky, so you require a higher gain antenna to get the same Buffalo channels. In your case you could go with an 8-bay instead of a CM4221 for Buffalo, or you could build a DBGH if you wish.

We can discuss that back in the Hamilton thread so that we don't get crossed threads happening. :)

I just changed out my single 4228 with 2 Eaglestar pro's (dual antenna setup that comes with mount and brackets) purchased from one of the great electronic stores at Dixie/Matheson.

With the new setup I am able to pick up 4 more channels (WNLO, CBLT-CBC, Global-Toronto, NBC) HOWEVER, I have lost WUTV 29 FOX! Of course that's my favorite channel.

Not sure if it has to do with my install. Both antenna's:eek: join together with splitter before coming into the house and to the TV.

I have them ganged together (side by side) facing the same direction.

I simply ran about 2 feet of RG6 from both into a phillips splitter (splitter was recommended to me at the store, as it has the proper frequency?).

Then I have another RG6 cable going out of the splitter directly to the receiver.

I wasn't aware that I could point them in different directions. I suppose I need to experiment.

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Also, I am close to lakeshore in Oakville and wonder if this is why i'm only getting 50% signal for CITY TV HD, and SUNTV.

I wonder if I were to point on toward buffalo and the other at a right angle from that one toward Toronto.?

You should be able to pick it up easy with 4228 point towards Buffalo, but you said your using two 4221 clones.

dual antenna setup that comes with mount and brackets
I can only assume you mean two gang together (side by side) similar to the 4228? Or do mean one pro pointed at CN tower and the other at Buffalo stations?
If it's the latter then you might have problems receiving channel 29. I'm pretty sure it has to do with you setup.

I have two antennas pointed separately at Buffalo/CN and get FOX29 perfectly. It may indeed be his implementation of the combining, but it DOES work if done correctly.

I just changed out my single 4228 with 2 Eaglestar pro's (dual antenna setup that comes with mount and brackets) purchased from one of the great electronic stores at Dixie/Matheson.
May I ask you why you changed out 4228 (Broken)? It is a very good UHF antenna and would do the job just fine. Combining it with a rotor would be the simplest way of getting all the channel in our area. There are pro's and con's to this method I won't get into.

I simply ran about 2 feet of RG6 from both into a phillips splitter (splitter was recommended to me at the store, as it has the proper frequency?).
Ok that helps clarify things. Basically you’re combining two clones similar to DB8 antenna. It should work ok, but the major difference other then the antenna it self, is the way it’s is terminated. (300 to 75 ohm) You could add a preamp to compensate for the losses of the two balums plus the third one. I have never tried this method but I have seen it before. Please let us know what results you get. If I am right I think you will get a polar pattern similar to a 4228 or DB8.

I wonder if I were to point on toward buffalo and the other at a right angle from that one toward Toronto.?

Several others members have done this before and have had good results, but combining antennas in different directions "can be very difficult". Thou I have done it I would not recommend it unless you like to experiment and are a hands one person. If I had your antennas I would I would the 4228 at Buffalo and one of clones at CN Tower. Since you have the clones combined all ready point it at CN tower and the 4228 at Buffalo. (One more splitter is required to combine the array. I won’t get into the pro’s and con’s of this combining antennas like this, but I will advise you to read as many postings as you can I am sure it will help you. Have look a Mississauga OTA.

Be careful out there I wouldn’t want you to fall. I fact I wouldn't do it in the winter.

Please read the OTA Knowledge Base & FAQ. It will answer and explain a lot of things you are interested in, see example bellow.

Originally Posted by 99gecko
This has been said many times before in different variations, but I'll repeat it now for the benefit of everyone. The type of antenna is just one variable in the reception mix for OTA.

These variables combined make every single OTA set-up unique.

For example, even in my house my reception is different in the basement than in the kitchen because the signal has to travel first to the basement for the HDTV, and then loop-out to the kitchen (for analogue).

Some variables that you have control over, or at least will vary between users in similar locations:
• Location of your antenna (indoor/outdoor)
• Height, direction, angle, & gain (type) of your antenna
• Length and type of cabling used (RG6/RG59/Twin Lead, etc)
• Whether or not a signal amplifer (pre-amp/distribution/booster) is needed/used and its proximity to the antenna.
• Local effects on your antenna: obstacles and reflective surfaces (buildings/trees/structures).
• Whether the antenna is fixed or on a rotor
• Age of the OTA Gear (new, used, ancient)
• Capablilties of your tuner (newer tuners have higher gain and are better at rejecting mulitpath interference)
Some of the other variables you can't control and affect all users (though not equally) such as:
• Broadcast antenna height/power/distance/direction/contour
• Weather factors
• Terrain

You said you have both antennas pointed in the same direction, which I would bet is your problem. You are likely getting multipath issues.

I would 90 degree them and see if that helps. Point one at Grand Island and one at the CN Tower. If you have them properly combined, this should improve things for you.

In my early testing, FOX29 was the first station to die from bad aiming and multipath...

Stu

Thanks Biggy and testu for the suggestions! Yesterday I scurried home with the new equipment in hand and put everything up before dark. Alas...today we got dumped on and as to Biggy's point, probably not a good idea to go back on the roof. I will do some more reading on multi-antenna's. I did read that the cable lengths should be EXACTLY the same before going into the splitter....that could be part of my problem...as I read this after i put it up.

Once I can get access to the roof, i'lll try some of your suggestions and report what i find.

Thanks!

Cable lengths should be as close to exact as possible, but there is a bit of forgiveness due to the signal's wavelength - but best to try to get them as perfect as you can.

Please let us know how it is going!

Stu

Guess my channel 9.1 CTV Toronto scanning problem is unique as no one has come forward with comments. At a total loss as to what to do next.

Bob

Hey guys

I am thinking of buying a indoor antenna. I have narrowed the choices to the Winegard ss-3000 and Antennas Direct DB2. I live in an apartment in Oakville on the 12 floor and I am facing opposite of the CN Tower (sucks). What do you guys suggest.

Also were do they sell the Winegard ss-3000 in Canada?

Thanks

Hey guys

I am thinking of buying a indoor antenna. I have narrowed the choices to the Winegard ss-3000 and Antennas Direct DB2. I live in an apartment in Oakville on the 12 floor and I am facing opposite of the CN Tower (sucks). What do you guys suggest.

Also were do they sell the Winegard ss-3000 in Canada?

Thanks
Hi Samsonite101,

Can you give us a compass range from the windows or doors in question? Or I suppose, a range from where you pan to place the antenna? Maybe an idea of the layout of your floor, construction materials etc...?

Stu

My results have been different with regards to winter vs. summer reception. My buffalo stations were 15-20% stronger in August when I installed my antenna. Right now the buffalo stations are running anywhere between 63-70% signal strength. Our Canadian stations on the other hand have remained strong ranging from 90-100%.

expressvu 9200 ota tuner
cm 4221 attic install
60' RG6

My results have been different with regards to winter vs. summer reception. My buffalo stations were 15-20% stronger in August when I installed my antenna. Right now the buffalo stations are running anywhere between 63-70% signal strength. Our Canadian stations on the other hand have remained strong ranging from 90-100%.

expressvu 9200 ota tuner
cm 4221 attic install
60' RG6
Snow and Ice on the roof??

Noise figure(5.5 db)Ooops, almost coughed up my coffee when I saw how high that number is! Add that to the fact that it isn't mounted right up at the antenna and you've got to be suffering with something like 6dB of noise on your line with that booster amp... :eek:

Did you check out the OTA links in the Where Can I Buy forum at our site? http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=164

I live in an apartment in Oakville on the 12 floorWelcome here - which major street corner are you nearest? Also check out the OTA links in the Where Can I Buy forum at our site for finding sources of OTA gear: http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=164

Thanks for the replies Tentsu and Stampeder

The major street I am located at is Rebecca street and Forsythe street.
The following link is my floorplan (except everything is on the left side, belcony etc.)
http://www.torontorentals.com/205Queenmary/2bdrm/houseTour.html

There is a building visible to the left of where I live and I am planning to place the antenna near the windows. With regards to the compass range, where do I find that information?

Thanks

Hi Guys, I am new here and I have a couple of questions

1. What is the best oudoor antenna to get maximum channels from both Toronto and Buffalo? There is an old mast available at my house.

2. Do I need a rotor to adjust the antenna's direction?

Thanks