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post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-17, 09:46 PM Thread Starter
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Question Old receiver, brand new TV.

I just ordered a Vizio E65-E1 65-in. SmartCast 4K Ultra HD Home Theatre Display. I have it all set up, and the image is amazing. We watched 4K Netflix, Blue Planet, and it was truly impressive. I have an old Yamaha 6160 AV receiver I was hoping to use, but I can't get it to output audio if I use the TV apps as a source. If I hook up a PS4 to the Yamaha with HDMI, and then output the HDMI to the TV, that works. I max out at 1080p, but that was expected. I can also pass DTS from the PS4 as my output audio, and it correctly illuminates the DTS light on the receiver (I watched it change from PCM to DTS). Sound is coming out of all 5.1 speakers.

My receiver does not have HDMI ARC. But it does have an optical out (3 of them actually). I tried to have the receiver decode the audio when using the Netflix app, but it remained silent. The TV manual said I have to turn off Audio Display in order to output DTS digital audio, so I did that. I also turned off the TV speakers, and set the audio output to bitstream. Then I tried the optical cable in each of the 3 ports, but could get no sound. There is a red light in the cable, so I know it is working. Finally, I plugged the optical cable from the TV's only optical out port into the Yamaha's AUX panel on the front of the unit, just to be sure I was selecting the correct input. Nothing. I suspect it may be overriding the optical because HDMI is still connected, so I thought about pulling all HDMI cables and only having a single optical cable from TV to receiver. Would that work?

Probably the best solution is a new receiver, but this Yamaha has served me extremely well for years, I am reluctant to retire it. And the reason I want to get the Yamaha working is for the headphone jack. Cinema DSP worked really well with a good pair of Alessandro's.

Thanks,
DD.
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post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 12:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dare978devil View Post
My receiver does not have HDMI ARC. But it does have an optical out (3 of them actually).
I assume these are optical inputs, not outputs. Sounds like you have everything else set up properly with the TV. Here are my recommendations.

1. Many times the inputs on complicated AVRs need to be "assigned". The inputs you have tried to use may not be properly "assigned", therefore no audio. You'll probably need to read the operating manual on how to assign audio inputs. I always download the OM when I purchase anything like an AVR so that I can search the pdf for terms like "assign". Often the "TV" input is properly assigned for optical, but that's not guaranteed.

2. Also, if you have an HDMI connection to the same "assigned" input, then the HDMI will override the optical if there is audio on the HDMI source.

3. Try Dolby Digital or PCM from the TV instead of DTS.

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post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 10:36 AM Thread Starter
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Yes, sorry, should have been more careful with the wording. You are correct, those are inputs.

1. and 2. That sounds promising. When I set up the inputs years ago, I labelled them as per the device (DVD, XBOX, etc.). I do remember the onscreen menu from the receiver allowed me to select the audio input per device, so for the original XBOX which did not have HDMI out, I selected component video + optical, whereas the DVD player was HDMI so I just left everything as is since that was the default. When I get home, I'll see if I can set up a device called TV with only audio as input.
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post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 01:17 PM Thread Starter
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Still not working unfortunately. Went into the receiver's menu, and turned off everything on the DTV input except optical. Set the receiver to DTV where the optical cable is plugged in, nothing. Turned all speaker options off on the TV, set output to Bitstream as instructed by the Vizio manual if I want to output mulit-channel sound, turned off CEC, nada. I can see a red light coming out of the Vizio's optical port when I remove the cable, and I can see a red light coming out of the cable when I plug it into the receiver, so I know the cable is working. I've tried all 3 different optical ins on the receiver in case one was blocked by dust. Still nothing.

I now have only HDMI out from receiver to HDMI1 on the TV in order to have the receiver menu on-screen. And only Optical out from the TV to DTV-optical in on the receiver. I've tried setting the TV's sound out options to Bitstream, PCM, and Dolby D. I start an app on the Vizio (Netflix) and make sure to select some non-high-end audio stream, for instance The Office which streams in 1080p with 5.1.

I can hook up the analog output just to make sure that something can pass from the TV to the receiver, but I am out of ideas. If I hook up the PS4 to one of the HDMI inputs on the receiver, and then the receiver to HDMI1 on the TV, that works. Sound is decoded by the receiver and comes out the speakers in the room. But I simply can't get it to work when the TV is the source. That optical out from the TV doesn't seem to want to pass audio to the receiver.

DD.
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post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 02:16 PM
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What happens if you connect the PS4 to the TV and optical output to the receiver? That should work. It works with my 2015 Vizio TV using a TV receiver, HTPC or Chromecast. (Don't use the Vizio apps so cannot comment on that.) If the TV has a tuner, a local TV station would be an even better audio source for testing.

The red light simply means that it is an output the and LED carrier is on. It is not an indication that any audio is present or that the device is configured correctly. It's not an indication that the audio cable is 100% functional. Those must all be determined separately.

If you get the PS4 and TV tuner working, through the TV, and the apps still don't work there are two likely reasons. One is that the audio type may be incompatible. The other is that it's a shortcoming of the TV.

I would start by plugging the PS4 into the TV or tuning in a local TV station.
1. Get it working with the TV speakers.
2. Turn the TV speakers off and set output to bitstream as per the manual.
3. Connect the TV optical output to one of the inputs on the receiver.
4. Configure the input to one of the receiver's sources. It may help to use a non-video source such as CD.
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post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 03:28 PM
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If the PS4 (or other device you can use to test - like borrowing a DVD player) has an optical output, give that a try on the AVR optical input(s). That'll tell you if it's a device issue, input issue and possibly even troubleshoot a bad optical cable since it should work from another device.

The PS4 will obviously need to be reconfigured to send audio via optical instead of HDMI, but I believe that's possible. Might be easier to borrow/find a DVD player (or any other device) with optical out.

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post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 03:32 PM Thread Starter
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I called Vizio support. Guy was quite helpful, seemed to know what he was talking about. He had me do exactly that, connect the PS4 to the TV and the optical out from the PS4 directly to the receiver. Then change the Sound Output options on the PS4 to optical out. That option appears when it detects an optical out cable. Did that, and no sound. Video was working fine, but no audio at all. It is possible my optical cable is bad, I can test it out with an old XBOX 360 by connecting component + optical to the receiver, and then the receiver to TV via HDMI. That would force the 360 to push audio via optical as there would be no other audio source. If that works, then I have to reach the conclusion reached by the Vizio support guy, and that is that some receivers' optical audio require a video signal on the same channel. I had previously used the optical-in, but it was for an original XBOX which only had component + optical as the best quality options. I have never used it solely to push only audio, it has always been associated with a video feed.
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post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 05:17 PM Thread Starter
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Well, that test didn't work out. The 360 needs a proprietary cable in order to connect to anything other than HDMI, and I have no idea where that cable is. Haven't used anything with the 360 in years. I can certainly order another optical cable, but that money would probably be better spent towards a new receiver. Ho hum....
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post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 07:24 PM Thread Starter
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I couldn't think of any other way to test the optical cable, so I just ordered a new one. I'll replace it, see if I can get digital sound out of the Vizio to the receiver. Would be great, then I could watch at night with headphones and not wake the kids up. I can do that now, but only if I go through the PS4 connected directly to the Yamaha. Would be much better to make the TV the central hub, that way I could try out PS4's support of HDR and other Ultra HD output.
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post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 09:46 PM
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My Vizio TV and Vizio soundbar work fine with only HDMI into the TV and only optical out to the soundbar. It sounds like it may be an issue with the optical cable or it could be an issue with the receiver. I'd test the receiver with another device and another optical cable to see if it will work. Many receivers have a reset procedure, something like CTRL-ALT-DEL but with receiver buttons. Don't know what the sequence is for the Yamaha receiver in question but it might be worth looking up.
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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-18, 11:12 PM
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I wouldn't do a reset until you try another device/cable directly to the AVR. Factory reset usually means that all your AVR preferences will be lost and you'll need to reconfigure. If you don't mind that, then OK. The reset procedure is usually in the troubleshooting section of the OM.

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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-21, 12:30 PM Thread Starter
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IT WORKS! It was the optical cable all along! Yay! I ordered a new one from Amazon, (Amazon Basics Toslink), it worked right away. Plugged it into the optical-in jack labelled DVD on the Yamaha, optical-out on the Vizio, switched to DVD input on the Yamaha, and boom, had digital audio from my wall-mounted speakers. I deliberately did not plug in an HDMI cable to the same DVD jack on the Yamaha, that jack which can accept HDMI, component + optical, or composite + old-school analog, only has the optical cable connected and that is it. Changing to the "DVD" input on the receiver brought music to my ears (and also out my speakers).

It's great, now I can use the TV's HDMI-ins as the basis for a hub instead of the Yamaha's. I'll be able to use the TV's apps so that I can watch in 4K, and hear audio out the surround sound speakers. Plus that also enables the headphone jack on the Yamaha for late-night 4K watching. Life is good!

Thanks,
DD.
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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-21, 02:48 PM
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Thanks for the feedback. Just remember that the TV likely won't pass any HD audio, like TrueHD or DTS-MA, so for that (if applicable from BDs for example) you'll need to connect directly to the AVR.

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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-21, 04:02 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks. I did a ton of research before buying the 6160 ~10 years ago or so. It had the largest collection of HD audio formats I could find without breaking the bank. Copied from the PDF, it supports :

Digital audio decoders
◆ Dolby TrueHD, Dolby Digital Plus decoder
◆ DTS-HD Master Audio, DTS-HD High Resolution Audio
decoder
◆ Dolby Digital/Dolby Digital EX decoder
◆ DTS/DTS-ES Matrix 6.1, Discrete 6.1, DTS 96/24 decoder
◆ Dolby Pro Logic/Dolby Pro Logic II/Dolby Pro Logic IIx decoder
◆ Neural Surround decoder

That's why I was so keen on keeping it alive. I didn't want to have to buy a new receiver if I didn't have to.

DD.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 2018-01-21, 04:18 PM
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Yes, I looked it up, but what I'm saying is that you probably can't go "through" the TV (using it as a hub) and get HD audio. You'll have to connect that device directly to the AVR via HDMI. I assume you'd use the PS4 for BDs and the audio would need to be set up properly, either having the PS4 do the decoding, or setting it to bistream and allowing the AVR to decode, because in that way you can actually see the AVR display "DTS-MA" or "True-HD" to confirm you're actually getting HD audio to the AVR.

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