Severe OTA Interference From New Digital Services Tower - Page 4 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #46 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 05:40 PM Thread Starter
 
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Hi Trip.

Just for you, a video of the piezzo-microwave no batteries required

http://s214.photobucket.com/albums/c...omicrowave.mp4

And it may just be me but sometimes I believe I am hearing that high pitched ringing sound in my head, and no I didnt just see an Aerosmith concert from the front row.

The piezzo sounds louder if you are actually here. There is a bit of noise on the camera microphone.

Multimeter gave me about 1 volt.
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post #47 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 05:55 PM
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at the end of the first video, the tone from the piezo speaker suddenly stops.
What did you do, if anything to stop it?
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post #48 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:00 PM
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Did you get any response from the media?
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post #49 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:04 PM Thread Starter
 
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On the first video it is my piano, and at the end I turn the piano off (you can see my finger turning it off in the lower left) to show the difference between the piano being on and off. In the second video it is just a tiny piezzo and when I move the camera closer you can hear it better, but then I pull the camera away at the end and the microphone points somewhere else.

I havent actually thought about going to the media. How would I do that - just call up the CBC?
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post #50 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:18 PM
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gotcha, no question, that would drive me nuts. maybe even more than the TVI.
Have ya tried contacting anyone at Rogers yet?

Quote:
I havent actually thought about going to the media. How would I do that - just call up the CBC?
Are there local news reporters there that do "troubleshooter" or "Call to action" like stories on the local news???
Maybe avoid the one that might be owned by Rogers though.
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post #51 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:41 PM
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I wonder if the 700 MHz being worse than the 800 Mhz or 1900 MHz on the same building is related to the modulation being used, more so than the frequency or ERP itself?
Kinda like when u hear that "GSM Buzz" from ur PC speakers with ur phone near it. U don't hear that on WCDMA or CDMA. A matter of which frequency band they are using for which technology, etc. Reason I say that is cause you also mention that it gets in to your landline telephone and PC Speakers also. Some spectrum analyzer screen shots would be cool, to see what an LTE signal looks like.
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post #52 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:42 PM
 
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I wrote up a post about it, using the media you've provided.

http://www.rabbitears.info/blog/inde...re-Case-of-RFI

Anything you would like changed or corrected, please let me know.

- Trip
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post #53 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:48 PM Thread Starter
 
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Hi Trip.

Im cool with it except the part about the TV station getting back to me. They did as they were quite concerned, but it was A-Channel that I contacted, not RogersOmni1. The interference on A-Channel turned out to be not so bad so I told them as soon as I knew. Channel 60 though, which is RogersOmni1, is still a big mess. The CTV/A-Channel people were responsive the same day. Here is the email:



Thanks Rob.

Yes looking forward to digital in the fall
- Hide quoted text -

On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 8:48 PM, Robert Edgley wrote:

Hi Gerry

Good to here 43 is ok now.
I was reading thru your emails and the reply from Industry Canada.
I will forward to our regulatory group and get their read on it.

Once this all goes digital in September that will clear it up as well.

Rob...


From: Gerry B
Sent: Thu 17/02/2011 6:45 PM
To: Ottawa TV Engineering
Subject: Re: Rogers is interfereing with A-Channel 43

Hi again. Sorry to bother you - the only channel Im getting bad interference on is channel 60. Channel 43 looks fine now.

On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 6:30 PM, Gerry B wrote:

Here is an attached picture of my best reception of A-Channel now on UHF 43. It used to be perfect


On Thu, Feb 17, 2011 at 6:07 PM, Gerry B wrote:

Hello

I am an avid A-Channel watcher from your over-the-air broadcast on channel 43. I live on the 13th floor of an apartment building with line-of-sight to your tower near Manotick. Just recently I have learned that there was some kind of PCS/ LTE? Rogers base station licensed at 734 MHz right across the street from where I live. There are thousands of people that live in the buildings on Lees Avenue. I can no longer get a decent picture on 43 even just using a simple dipole antenna placed in the window facing your TV transmitter.

I wrote to Industry Canada but they suggested I try to resolve this on my own. I know enough about radio waves to know that this is serious interference being caused to your station.

Can you help me? You are welcome to come here to see just how bad it is. I will also try to take a photo and send it. Ive done quite a bit of research on the license numbers which you can see at the bottom of this email.

Thanks,
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post #54 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:49 PM
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Have you tried Health Canada?

http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ewh-semt/radi.../index-eng.php

If you have questions, you can call one of our Customer Service Representatives from Monday to Friday between 7 am and 5 pm (EST):

•toll-free outside The National Capital Region at
1-800-261-6689
•in the National Capital Region at
613-954-6689

NDS-SND@hc-sc.gc.ca
____________________________________________

To make an inquiry regarding cell phones and base station compliance assessments, contact Industry Canada's Spectrum Engineering Branch.

Eastern Ontario District
Industry Canada
Radio Frequency Spectrum Management
Bell Canada Building
Suite C-100
160 Elgin St., 11th floor
Ottawa, Ont.
K2P 2P7
Telephone: 613-998-3693
Fax: 613-998-5919
Email: spectrum.ottawa@ic.gc.ca
Hours of Operation: 8:30 a.m. - 4:30 p.m.

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post #55 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:49 PM
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I know 2G GSM is very narrowband--that and the on/off nature of the modulation creates the "mosquito" buzz effect. LTE, despite being scalable, isn't narrowband. Though you could be onto something. However, I've never heard of GSM cell sites--which are still in use by Rogers here in Canada--interfering with TV, phones, etc. Usually the interference effect is very short range, like having your phone next to a speaker.

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post #56 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:51 PM
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OTA_Canuck: I'm pretty sure this station would be in compliance--considering the permitted ERP as mentioned in the IC database. Though it wouldn't hurt to contact them anways I suppose...

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post #57 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:56 PM
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It could be that IC's current level of "compliance" is not safe enough! Industry Canada only relies on someone else's tests and opinions within the industry [such as big coprporate sponsored lobbyists] to determine what is safe and then IC sets the rules of compliance based on their reports.

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post #58 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 06:58 PM
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Quote:
However, I've never heard of GSM cell sites--which are still in use by Rogers here in Canada--interfering with TV, phones, etc.
Neither have I, but since this is supposedly an LTE Transmitter on 700 MHz, there's no real history yet, right? Why I mentioned it.

from that linked to wikpedia entry on LTE
Quote:
The LTE transmission is structure in the time domain in radio frames. Each of this radio frames is 10 ms long and consists of 10 sub frames of 1 ms each. For non-MBMS subframes the OFDM subcarrier spacing in the frequency domain is 15 kHz. Twelve of these subcarriers together are called a resource block. A LTE terminal can be allocated in the downlink or uplink a minimum of 1 resource block during 1 subframe.
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post #59 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 07:02 PM Thread Starter
 
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ota_canuck,

I did contact the second address you mention - that is where I sent the letter in the beginning of this thread - to spectrum.ottawa@ic.gc.ca. They got back to me the next day saying they dont do investigations for this.

The level by the window is not quite at Safety Code 6, which is 4 watts per meter square, so there is no point contacting Health Canada. They will just say that radio waves only have a heating effect but not a microwave effect according to the predominant scientific evidence, and that they use a 10:1 safety factor in their code anyway. Too bad for me we dont have the russian limits or swiss safety limits here. Then they would have to change the tilt angle or get a higher tower.
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post #60 of 148 (permalink) Old 2011-02-18, 07:04 PM Thread Starter
 
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The worst part about LTE is the modulation that sounds like an ear ringing, with clicking. And because it is LTE at 700 MHz and not up closer to 900 MHz or 1800 MHz, it really does penetrate walls more than the other bands. My apartment has become a waveguide for their signal.
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