U.S. DTV Minor Networks (TCN, Antenna TV, Cool TV, MHz, etc.) - Page 2 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #16 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-02, 03:59 PM
 
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ota, you're thinking analog. ATSC is just a big stream of bits that you can slice up in a variety of ways. To see the technical aspects of how US stations are using their bitstreams, consult the RabbitEars website. Click on a market to expose the station listings, then click on a station to reveal its technical specifications and programming.
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post #17 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-02, 06:16 PM
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OK! It shows that they are all 480i.... so how many streams can they possibly have within their allotted frequency?

Code:
32 29 WANN-CA ATLANTA GA           
DisplayChannel PhysicalChannel Video Audio Call Sign Network/Programming    Nickname Notes  Print  
32-01 29.1  480i DD1.0  APGuide Guide  
32-02 29.2  480i DD1.0  MTVTr3s MTV tr3s   
32-03 29.3  480i DD1.0  this TV This TV   
32-04 29.4  480i DD1.0  prism Movies  
32-05 29.5  480i DD2.0  Oldie Classic Shows  
32-06 29.6  480i DD2.0  SHOP LATV   (Soon) 
32-07 29.7  480i DD1.0  TUFF TV Tuff TV   
32-08 29.8  480i DD2.0  LEGACY Legacy TV   
32-09 29.9  480i DD2.0  JTV Jewelry TV   
32-10 29.10  480i DD2.0  CORNER Corner Store TV   
32-21  29.21   DD2.0  640WGST Audio "640 WGST" 
32-22  29.22   DD2.0  94.9BUL Audio "94.9 The Bull" 
32-23  29.23   DD2.0  96.1PRJ Audio "Project 9-6-1" 
32-24  29.24   DD2.0  96.7LGD Audio "96.7 The Legend" 
32-25  29.25   DD2.0  105.3 Audio "105.3 El Patron" 
32-26  29.26   DD2.0  105.7 Audio "Groove 105.7"

Now,.. looking at this makes me believe they have 2 allotted frequencies in play.
[Possibly? Channel RF29 & Channel RF31 and they use the 32.x psip?]
Code:
Technical Data and Screencaps  
FAC-ID: 53585   TSID: 4075 (0x0FEB)

LD-APP: Channel 29  ATLANTA, GA (SCM)    
BSTA‑20090309ACN (1299315) - App 
1079' 15 kW CA (  ) (37 Mile Contour) 
1151' AGL (1223132) 
  N 33░ 48' 26" (33.807), W 84░ 20' 21.8" (-84.339) (S) (F)  
LD-APP: Channel 31  ATLANTA, GA (SCM)    
BDISDTL‑20091015ABG (1338453) - App 
1043' 15 kW DA (  ) (37 Mile Contour / 2198 Sq. Mi. Area) 
(0.5 kW TPO + 14.77 dB gain = 15 kW ERP) 
  1115' AGL (1223132) 
  N 33░ 48' 26" (33.807), W 84░ 20' 21.8" (-84.339) (S) (F)  

  TSReader Data: HTML Export (04/13/2010)    
  Bitrate Allocation: Unknown
direct link to page info does not work, however the above info is from rabbitears.com> see:Atlanta Georgia for WANN CA

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post #18 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-02, 10:44 PM
 
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For FCC filings, the prefix is the key. BSTA means the record is a Special Temporary Authority to operate with the parameters given. BDISDTL means Displacement Digital low power. As low-power stations are secondary users of the spectrum, they can be bounced by full-power and a special class of low-power stations. The string of filings is a little confusing, but the upshotnis if the displacement is approved, they will switch to the new facility. They are using only one channel.
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post #19 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-02, 11:36 PM
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DD1.0 is monaural audio too, so that means even less bandwidth usage needed by each channel using it.
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post #20 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-03, 09:00 AM
 
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By clicking the Technical Details and Screencaps link, you can get the nominal bitrate for all the subchannels. (Nominal for stations using variable bit rate encoding.) For WANN, the details are (edited):

Code:
Digital Display Call   Video Dimensions Aspect Video   Audio Audio
Chnl    Chnl    Sign                    Ratio          Type  Bitrate
29.1   32-01  APGuide  480i   528x480    4:3  1.65Mbps DD1.0  96kbps 
29.2   32-02  MTVTr3s  480i   528x480    4:3  1.25Mbps DD1.0  96kbps 
29.3   32-03  this TV  480i   528x480    4:3  1.65Mbps DD1.0  96kbps 
29.4   32-04  prism    480i   528x480    4:3  1.65Mbps DD1.0  96kbps 
29.5   32-05  Oldie    480i   352x480    4:3  1.25Mbps DD2.0  96kbps 
29.6   32-06  SHOP     480i   528x480    4:3  1.75Mbps DD2.0  96kbps 
29.7   32-07  TUFF TV  480i   528x480    4:3   1.3Mbps DD1.0  96kbps 
29.8   32-08  LEGACY   480i   528x480    4:3  1.35Mbps DD2.0 192kbps 
29.9   32-09  JTV      480i   528x480    4:3   1.6Mbps DD2.0  96kbps 
29.10  32-10  CORNER   480i   352x480    4:3  1.55Mbps DD2.0  96kbps 
29.21  32-21  640WGST                                  DD2.0  96kbps 
29.22  32-22  94.9BUL                                  DD2.0  96kbps 
29.23  32-23  96.1PRJ                                  DD2.0  96kbps 
29.24  32-24  96.7LGD                                  DD2.0  96kbps 
29.25  32-25  105.3                                    DD2.0  96kbps 
29.26  32-26  105.7                                    DD2.0  96kbps
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post #21 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-03, 10:57 AM
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Thanks for those tips, Dave! Clearly WANN's owners are going for quantity with little regard for quality.
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post #22 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-03, 01:13 PM
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So how many sub-channels could you have on an OTA channel?

Alternatively, what if one (the main one) is an HD one- how many subs could you have?

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post #23 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-03, 01:58 PM
 
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There's no one answer to that question. If you ask ABC owned&operated stations, the answer is two "HD" and one SD. For many PBS stations, the answer is one HD plus 3 SD. Some stations run 5 SDs (and they can look pretty good) and some stations will run up to 10 SD. It's all about how much bandwidth can be allocated, and how adroitly an encoder can vary the instantaneous bandwidth between subs. In any case, I think an average of less than 2 Mbps will not provide a very good SD picture.

Last edited by stampeder; 2010-09-03 at 09:45 PM.
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post #24 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-03, 02:25 PM
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Wikipedia has a pretty good explanation of the effect adding sub channels has.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital...considerations
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post #25 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-14, 09:57 AM
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Subchannel "The Country Network" picked-up by Sinclair Broadcasting

This press release might be of interest to many OTAers:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...101317669.html

It says that Sinclair Broadcasting Group Inc. has picked up distribution of The Country Network OTA subchannel. So now OTAers may have hope for a new (I would say interesting) channel.

The Country Network (TCN) is a country music video channel from Music Row in Nashville, TN.

The story implies that The Country Network might be distributed everywhere Sinclair Broadcasting has channels - most markets in the USA.

Sinclair has many Fox, MyTV, and some CW, ABC, CBS, and NBC affliates. Many broadcast ThisTV and TheCoolTV.

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post #26 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-21, 03:02 PM
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TCN The Country Network Officially Coming to Buffalo

Today I got an email from The Country Network. It was a response to an email I sent a few days ago expressing excitement about the prospect of a country music OTA station becoming available for those in Buffalo and Southern Ontario:
------------------------------
Great news! The Country Network will be in Buffalo (and so hopefully viewable for you all in Toronto). We do not have an exact date that we will be on air yet, but it will be sometime in the next 1-3 months.

We are so happy to hear that you are excited about TCN.

Thanks for your message!!
------------------------------

The watch begins....

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post #27 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-25, 12:12 AM
 
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Cool TV is really cool !!

I gotta say Cool TV is a good addition. The only SD channels that I keep are Think Bright and Cool TV. I watched a little bit of 2-2 and 2-3 again and those low bandwidth subs are pretty had on the eyes.

Cool TV is actually quite watchable even with zoom. 49-2 is also updated in Windows Media Center to reflect the Music program block they are showing. Like the PSIP data, there is no useful info otherwise.

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post #28 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-25, 08:19 AM
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Ya, COOL is cool- reminds of "Toronto Rocks" with John Major on CITY TV after school in the 80s- just payed music videos, unlike MM which never seems to play them.

Anyways, I found 2.3 to be pretty good in PQ, but that's on my 22" LG, TV size definitely is a factor. But also, some shows just seem better- the "A" team on 2.3 is not very good, while old western shows ("Davey Crockett", "Wagon Train") are much better.

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post #29 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-09-28, 09:35 PM
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20 subchannels within the 19.39Mb/s ATSC spectrum

Here's some interesting reading about the growing multiple subchannel industry.

Quote:
A growing number of low-power stations are quickly recognizing the potential of digital transmission for expanding service offerings, raising video quality and creating new revenue streams. Now, these stations can follow the lead of KAXT-CA, a Class A community station based in San Jose, CA. This year, KAXT launched an unprecedented digital ATSC television service capable of broadcasting up to 20 MPEG-2 video and audio services within the 19.39Mb/s ATSC spectrum. Using advanced video processing solutions from Harmonic, transmission equipment from Linear Industries, and PSIP generation from Triveni Digital, KAXT is currently broadcasting 12 video channels and four audio channels and is already planning to add four more audio services.
READ MORE: http://broadcastengineering.com/exce...wards/kaxt-ca/

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post #30 of 151 (permalink) Old 2010-10-02, 07:55 AM
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This TV is great with those classic movies and tv programs filling another niche in the OTA world
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tcn , the country network , thecooltv

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