Ideas for DTV Sub-Channels in Canada? - Page 5 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums

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post #61 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-22, 12:35 PM
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Hi Billsmith, having CBC News Channel (nee Newsworld) as an OTA channel or subchannel is a popular idea amongst our members, but as mentioned it has some show-stoppers in the way. I've moved your post into this thread containing some good prior discussion about it.
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post #62 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 12:32 AM
 
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Question Are the CRTC a little confused??

Thank you Stampeder.

Quote:
On another note, you gotta love the cable and satellite companies, that never included an OTA tuner in their boxes, like the U.S.companies, to keep competition out. Maybe this could be a compromise to the T.V. tax, if the CRTC does not give the OTA stations money from the sat/cable companies. The CRTC could allow OTA stations to add subchannels like Newsworld or Regional Sports feeds to augment their incomes and allow direct competition to the Cable/Satellite companies. This is a better option than a T.V. tax.
It seems to me that the CRTC is a little confused in that they appear to think that the broadcast industry in Canada are the BDUs (i.e. the Satelite and Cable companies). Why don't they consider more carefully the real program producers representing the heart of the Canadian culture and local information like local news? Placing more local OTA subchannels with local news (including CBC Newsworld) and other local program content certainly makes complete sense to me! But then I am very used to UK TV system where this is already done. Satelite and cable in the UK are certainly options but usually only when folks already have their OTA channels but are still not completely satisfied!

Anyhow my mum always taught me that the best things in life are free! (Ofcourse UK TV requires a OTA
recieve licence but not yet here in the "New World")

Last edited by Billsmith; 2009-11-23 at 12:53 AM.
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post #63 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 02:54 AM
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post #64 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billsmith View Post
He responded that he would consider HD OTA reception if the CBC broadcast their news Channel OTA! (He is presently a cable BDU subscriber). I wonder how many other folks may consider this if given that possibilty? The BBC in the UK include their BBC News 24 Channel on the UK digital OTA UHF multiplexes nationally! I guess the equivalent in Canada would be to use a CBC subchannel e.g. A future Channel 9.2 as referred to in the case of CBRT in Calgary.

Anyone think that this would fly? Probably seems extremely optimistic right now!
While this is good in theory the reason it won't happen is who is going to pay for it? The local channels are screaming that they need more money as ads are not enough to pay for their expenses and they want to charge a tax on BDU subscribers. So why would they (the OTA channels and networks) want to make it more attractive for Canadians to move away from BDUs? I think we are far more likely to go in the other direction and see some OTA channels go away and become BDU only, especially if they lose this current fight.

The CBC has stayed out of this fray so far, but I sure don't think they would like giving up the subscriber revenue that they currently get from Newsworld - such as your neighbour.
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post #65 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 06:04 PM
 
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Subchannels for local and non-local Canadian programming.

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While this is good in theory the reason it won't happen is who is going to pay for it? The local channels are screaming that they need more money as ads are not enough to pay for their expenses and they want to charge a tax on BDU subscribers. So why would they (the OTA channels and networks) want to make it more attractive for Canadians to move away from BDUs? I think we are far more likely to go in the other direction and see some OTA channels go away and become BDU only, especially if they lose this current fight.
Wayne. Thank you for your response! I believe that Canadian culture and content is more important than the existance and use of BDU's. Ofcourse it is to be hoped that the broadcasters win the current fight simply to protect the Canadian broadcast industry. I see that BDUs really are for program distribution and so do not represent the bare bones broadcasting industry here at home. I would hope that additional financing could come from the OTA local channel advertising and also partly from an additional FFC paid by the BDUs. My thinking is that subchannels will provide for transmission of extra local material and produce additional revenue in order to pay for their expenses. The BDU output is largely US programming which is simply a controlled way of Canadians buying US programming and supporting the American broadcast and production industry at the expense of our own. Something which Canadian individuals are not allowed to do personally. I remember when we were no longer allowed to purchase Direct TV for example. This rule was made (if I remember correctly) to protect the Canadian broadcast Industry but it hasn't resulted in any more Canadian programming local or otherwise. Subchannels can provide an ideal vehicle for local and non-local programming distribution possibly at reduced cost.

Last edited by Billsmith; 2009-11-23 at 10:04 PM. Reason: Formatting
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post #66 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
It seems to me that the CRTC is a little confused in that they appear to think that the broadcast industry in Canada are the BDUs
Read the bio's of the CRTC leadership and you'll see why. BDUs also have lobbyists. The only way there can be OTA lobbyists is to intervene in the hearings. Stampeder usually informs us when they occur and how to get involved.

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post #67 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-23, 10:01 PM
 
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Thank you for your response El Gran Chico! I will be all eyes!

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post #68 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-24, 10:48 AM
 
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Just a thought for a sub-channel...Since Christmas (or should I be more politically correct and say Holiday season) is around the corner, something ideal would be the "fireplace" video. It wouldn't cost too much to any of the broadcasters to videotape a fire roaring in a fireplace, then loop the video over and over again. Even have some music playing in the background....maybe.

Just a thought for the holiday season.

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post #69 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-24, 11:05 AM
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I highly doubt if broadcasters will use sub-channels unless a business case can be made for them to make money since it would cost a lot of money in applications to the CRTC and equipment to get it running and then there are the complaints when things don't work.
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post #70 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-24, 08:34 PM
 
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I noticed that the Americans seem to be using subchannels successfully in Houston. Perhaps they use a significantly different bussiness model?
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post #71 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-25, 10:52 AM
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It is not so much a different business model, rather a regulatory model, in that the FCC takes mostly hands off stand of what they can air on their main and secondary sub-channels, allow new and innovative things happen, as well as some channels that are psuedo competiive with cable programming (something which the CRTC prohibits, on account of lobbying from Pelmorex and others).
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post #72 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-25, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by classicsat View Post
It is not so much a different business model, rather a regulatory model, in that the FCC takes mostly hands off stand of what they can air on their main and secondary sub-channels, allow new and innovative things happen, as well as some channels that are psuedo competiive with cable programming (something which the CRTC prohibits, on account of lobbying from Pelmorex and others).
Very true. The CRTC has made it clear that sub-channels will only be approved for new and innovative purposes that don't compete with existing cable channels.
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post #73 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-25, 01:23 PM
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I keep getting the impression that the CRTC is a big impediment to communications services in this country. They've long outlived their usefulness, if they ever had any.
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post #74 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-25, 02:16 PM
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OTA Channels Moving to Cable/Sat.

I don't think OTA channels will move to paid services (BDUs), that is as long as US signals can easily be received here in Canada. If that happens, the vacuum will be filled with US content, and I don't think the CRTC wants that.

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post #75 of 176 (permalink) Old 2009-11-25, 09:47 PM
 
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It really seems that some fresh blood is required for the CRTC. Maybe they could be left to assign frequencies, although in my area they don't seem particularly good at that. In the UK (a reletively small country) there are about 1100 TV towers of varying types bringing OTA TV to 98% of the population and 5 analog channels were transmitted from most of them. The new digital multiplex system allows for 6 UHF Multiplexed channels for each of the high and medium powered towers and 3 for each of the filler towers. The frequencies are standardized into neat frequency groups characterized by sub-band letters A thru' W (W being wide band). This allows for higher gain antennas to be manufactured for each group except W. They transmit at least 6 program channels per mutiplex at SDTV and with a channel reduction may also be used for HDTV. Where and who are the OTA lobby groups in Canada I wonder? The hearings seem to need some serious intervention.

Last edited by Billsmith; 2009-11-25 at 10:21 PM.
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