Cogeco HD/PVR (6412/6416) problem / question / results thread - Page 3 - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums
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post #31 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-21, 04:26 PM
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: ThunderBay,ON
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"volume fluctuation on channels btw 1-100 is a receiver,"

I dont buy that for a single minute.
I have 2 boxes, hooked up to 2 seperate TV's with 2 seperate recievers, and the channels between 1-100 have volume fluctuations of as much 27db. None of this happened when I had expressvu. So it is either the feed, or the cable boxes, and being that both boxes are differant (6412 and 1800) I would have to say its the cable feed.
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post #32 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-21, 04:37 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Ancaster, ON
Posts: 113
6412 Pq

The tech guy arrived .He was very helpful and genuinely committed to addressing my issues even if the PQ improvement is insignificant at best . .He tested the signal , changed the amplifier ( for VOD ),tried attenuating the signal at the STB( because some don't handle overload well ), changed all the connectors , nothing helped .He hinted that there was too much compression applied at the head end (that they were aware of it ,and would resolve it eventually , but he couldn't say when )It shows as fuzziness or "ringing" around faces etc. Once he pointed it out , it explained most of my complaints about picture quality .
I told him that my previous DCT 2000 ( now relegated to another room with a non-hd projection ) did not have these issues and was great on my HD projection TV in the past so I was sure it was the 6412 that was somehow defective . So he went and got the DCT 2000 and hooked it up to my HD ( via S-video as before ) and ,guess what, no better than the 6412 .So ends my theory about the defective 6412 .
He did not say it but I got the message that Cogeco is applying more compression than previously ( instead of more bandwidth I guess ) but it would be resolved ultimately .As someone mentioned in an earlier post , this may be causing the audio fluctuatons .
As with all of my recent experiences with Cogeco , I was impressed with the service , even if it seems I have to wait for improvement .Incidentally , the pixelation , tiling , video and audio dropouts seem to have stopped although it's been only one day .The tech said they were recabling in the area for the past couple of weeks so this was likely the culprit .

Samsung 52A750; Onkyo 3008; Panny bd55; 9.1 Paradigm, APC conditioner
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post #33 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-21, 04:51 PM
 
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Location: ThunderBay,ON
Posts: 953
The big problem Cogeco is having in many areas is lack of available bandwidth, add in heavy bandwidth demands placed on the system by HD and they are left with 2 options.
Upgrade the entire system or compress the crap out of everything.
One day they will upgrade most areas (I know Sarnia is a long ways down that list), but for the time being, compression to the max is the order of the day.

Can anyone do a little test for me?
If you have PBS-HD, tune to it. Press power off on your reciever and within 2 seconds, press OK. You will enter a diagnostic screen. scroll down to number 6, hit OK and write down what the bandwith is in mhz.

Mine is 507.0 mhz

press OK

now scroll to number 3 and press OK

My SNR is 37.2 and below is 55%

Can anyone else in other regions share their numbers with me.

Thanks
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post #34 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-21, 06:27 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 22
Thanks for the news regarding Windsor. I was at the Cogeco booth at the mall last week and they told me it would be spring when it would be available. I gues I will go back and talk with them again. Also, it is good to know that they are improving the lines but 1-3 years is an awful long time to wait.

_______________
Toshiba 57H81,Marantz SR7200
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post #35 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-21, 11:46 PM
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oakville
Posts: 44
It is in fact the box/cable signal that causes these problems without question. My Marantz receiver indicates on the front screen when the incoming signal is non existent or when it cuts off, says "No Audio" this happens often with the 6208 only, does not happen with any of my other components. Someone say bandwidth earlier?? It's quite annoying watching a PPV HD movie and the audio cuts out 6 times during it.
I'll just wait till the same issues are fixed before switching to the 6412

Sony 55XS955, Marantz SR7400, Samsung HDDVD841, Monster HTS3600, Athena ASF1/ASB2/ASC1, 2 X MKV10 subs, Motorola 6208
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post #36 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-22, 12:35 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Ancaster, ON
Posts: 113
bandwidth

In Burlington ,PBS HD is 567.0 mhz
d3 =20.0db and AGC is 21%
I think more indicative is d6 Current channel status
d6= 36.4db and AGC is 53%

see :cjhenginering.com

Samsung 52A750; Onkyo 3008; Panny bd55; 9.1 Paradigm, APC conditioner
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post #37 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 12:59 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Ancaster, ON
Posts: 113
drop outs

The audio and video drop outs are back ( maybe they never left ).Watched
I,Robot last night on PPV .Before the movie started ,on the Viewers Choice intros ,there were several dropouts : the movie was fine , and immediately after they started up again . Almost like someone was controlling this .

Samsung 52A750; Onkyo 3008; Panny bd55; 9.1 Paradigm, APC conditioner
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post #38 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 03:12 PM
 
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Location: Oakville
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Biglyle I did not say the problem was caused by the receiver. The root cause is either the signal or how the box handles the signal. It just happens that the receiver does not like to signal it gets. Other receivers do not reveal the problem.

I noticed the problem when I switched from a Kenwood vr-509 to a Pioneer 54tx. The difference is the Kenwood does not decode the dialnorm data. My Pioneer indicates a dial norm of +4 for on every channel except the ones that are messed up. Which would be consistant with the theory that it is a normalization problem.

Also keep in mind that it is not just a fluctuation in the volume. If you have the same problem you will notice that even if you turn down the volume to a reasonable listening level on the channels with a high audio output there is severe distortion.

Audio drop outs and pixilation are a different thing. They are related to signal strength. But as you said it is all traced back to Cogeco. Many other providers use these boxes with no problem. The only difference is the feed.
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post #39 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 03:35 PM
 
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"My Pioneer indicates a dial norm of +4 for on every channel except the ones that are messed up. Which would be consistant with the theory that it is a normalization problem."

I can tune into 10 differant channels and get 10 different readings. Dial norms of +2, +4, all the way to -27. I get no distortion when I turn the volume either up or down.

I get this on all my sets, even the one without a box hooked up to it, just straight analog coaxial cable to the back of the TV, and still there are hugh swings in volume, and I mean huge.

This is a signal issue, at least in Sarnia it is, that is for sure.
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post #40 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 04:19 PM
IHM
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Burlington
Posts: 108
1st 30db of difference like a lawnmower vs a jet engine. I'm pretty sure there isn't that much difference in the audio feeds despite the numbers your reciever is giving you. Regardless I recognize that there is a large difference in volume between certain stations.

2nd It's not a signal issue. There isn't a signal issue that would make certain audio on certain stations quieter than others. I expect that the feeds we get from the various providers fluctuate quite a bit. In fact I notice one of the time shifting channels with audio so quiet that the spaces between the words were "dropping out" because there wasn't enough resolution.

If your using the analog outs you can turn on the compression and this will smooth out the volume differences.

All opinions expressed are my own.
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post #41 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 05:52 PM
 
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"I'm pretty sure there isn't that much difference in the audio feeds despite the numbers your reciever is giving you."

well you are wrong, there is that much of a differance.
One station is big time loud, one you cant even hear. Measuring with an SPL meter the differances are at times over 30db.
SO next time, dont correct me without hearing my situation first hand.

thanks
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post #42 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-24, 06:58 PM
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubby
Biglyle I did not say the problem was caused by the receiver. The root cause is either the signal or how the box handles the signal. It just happens that the receiver does not like to signal it gets. Other receivers do not reveal the problem.

I noticed the problem when I switched from a Kenwood vr-509 to a Pioneer 54tx. The difference is the Kenwood does not decode the dialnorm data. My Pioneer indicates a dial norm of +4 for on every channel except the ones that are messed up. Which would be consistant with the theory that it is a normalization problem.

Also keep in mind that it is not just a fluctuation in the volume. If you have the same problem you will notice that even if you turn down the volume to a reasonable listening level on the channels with a high audio output there is severe distortion.

Audio drop outs and pixilation are a different thing. They are related to signal strength. But as you said it is all traced back to Cogeco. Many other providers use these boxes with no problem. The only difference is the feed.
I get the same problem with my 56TXi. Channels that make the receiver display the dialnorm(regardless of value) sound fine. Others that don't sound loud and distrorted even with the volume turned way down. I've resorted to locking these channels just incase I turn to one by accident with the volume up on the receiver. Don't want to loose a tweeter.

ht_addict
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post #43 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-01-25, 10:01 AM
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Oakville
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Quote:
get this on all my sets, even the one without a box hooked up to it, just straight analog coaxial cable to the back of the TV, and still there are hugh swings in volume, and I mean huge.
You got a different problem then. My analogue tv does not have more then the usual amount of volume fluctuation. Probably 2-3db at the most. Do any of your neighbors have the same problem with their stadard cable feed? That would tell you if it's a problem on your end or Cogeco's end.
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post #44 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-02-09, 03:45 PM
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 34
I got my box hooked up yesterday.. So far so good..

I am wondering if people can comment about the quality of the component cables included with the 6412. Normally, I don't even take "enclosed" cables out of their plastic bags. I am currently using the component cables included and I am wondering if I will see any different with buying different cables....
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post #45 of 708 (permalink) Old 2005-02-12, 12:21 PM
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oakville
Posts: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by biglyle
Can anyone do a little test for me?
If you have PBS-HD, tune to it. Press power off on your reciever and within 2 seconds, press OK. You will enter a diagnostic screen. scroll down to number 6, hit OK and write down what the bandwith is in mhz.
Here's my stats

Mine is 567.0 mhz
My SNR is 20.6 and below is 18%

I really dont' have a clue what this means. Anyone care to fill me in?

Sony 55XS955, Marantz SR7400, Samsung HDDVD841, Monster HTS3600, Athena ASF1/ASB2/ASC1, 2 X MKV10 subs, Motorola 6208
Cardas/Tributaries/MCTHX1000
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