Youtube 4k videos... - Canadian TV, Computing and Home Theatre Forums
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-20, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Etobicoke
Posts: 1,094
Youtube 4k videos...

Not sure where might be the best place for this, but since I am getting my internet from Rogers 1Gb/100Mb service thought I'd ask here.

I recently bought a 4k OLED with HDR10 and Dolbyvision support, and of course all my 4k content is coming from the web. Amazon Prime with HDR content, Netflix with 4k and some 4k Dolbyvision content are the main contributors but there are a few YouTube channels with 4k videos in the mix (like some DigitalFoundry videos). Watching Netflix or Amazon seems to be no issue in getting the full quality of the source streamed in, I think this is something like 15-25 mbps only, a small fraction of the bandwidth available. But YouTube video as displayed in the Stats for Nerds (or whatever that's called) overlay seems to almost never get to full 4k even when the source clearly is, or it will manage it for short periods and then give up. This happens either directly on the LG TV app or via the Xbox One X app. Sometimes it will hover between 1080 and full 4k but more often than not just 1080.

Has anyone else experienced this, or getting the full experience either on Rogers, Bell, or whoever? Is this a YouTube thing, or YouTube not getting a deal like Netflix for better connections through Rogers, or what? Short of trucking my xbox over to someone with Fibe and a 4k tv to test it on I can't easily rule out any part of the chain.

Jethro - LG OLED65C7P, NB 3.0, Yam HTR6190, Polk, Harmony 680, Xbox One X
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-20, 02:08 PM
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Toronto, Rogers, 9865 & 8300-eHDD, Sharp LC75N8000U, Denon AVR4310Ci; Sony KDL40W3000, 9865
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It may depend on the time of day. I have not streamed a lot of 4K content from YouTube, but I have done some testing using 4K videos on my 4K Sharp TV. There are some (rare) days/times when the downloads limit the resolution to 720P, or even 480i for short periods of time. However, typically when I check the "stats for nerds" I almost always get the max indicated at the source. I'm connected via the TV's WiFi to my Airport Extreme router, which is two floors away using my Sharp TV's app for YouTube. The "download bitrate" is always more than adequate to build lots of buffer under the "stats for nerds". I watch mostly music videos which are typically 720P or 1080P.

BTW, I'm on Rogers "80GB Express" which is a grandfathered plan that has download of (only) 30 mbps and upload of 5 mbps. When I do a speedtest, those numbers are always met or exceeded and are perfectly adequate for our use, since there are only two of us and we rarely do simultaneous downloading/streaming.

I'm guessing that the issue (limit?) is at YouTube's end, depending on the time of day.

FYI, I usually stream the WRC races on my computer and get buffering if I do it during prime time, so I almost always stream RedbullTV at around midnight when I never encounter any buffering from RedbullTV. The buffering is not a Rogers issue at these "speeds".

57's Home Theatre (Latest equipment & photos)
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-20, 03:10 PM
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Be aware that, perhaps surprisingly, a lot of 4K YouTube content has incredibly high video bit-rates - particularly when you get into the 60fps stuff. I've seen 100 Mbps + for some videos via the "stats for nerds" overlay. Netflix and Amazon are far lower - usually around 18 to 20 Mbps.

So depending on your network connection (wireless vs wired) and time-of-day (primetime or not), you may not have enough bandwidth to sustain those 4K YouTube bit-rates.

Generally speaking - I have more consistent YouTube 4K results with my Nvidia Shield wired to my Rogers router versus my LG OLED's built-in YouTube app over wifi.

By the way, are you sure you have 100Mbps upload speed? I understood Rogers maxed out at 50Mbps (I have Rogers 1Gbs/50Mbps service).

Last edited by 57; 2018-02-20 at 03:27 PM. Reason: Unnecessary Quote Removed
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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-21, 06:33 PM
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Thornhill
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I just tried the following on my OLED, wired internet connected with Rogers 100Mbps:

- Dynasty Warriors 9 (4K)
- A Developer Wants to Sue (4K)
- Shadow of War (4K)

Stats for Nerds shows:

Viewport 1920x1080*2
Current / Optimal Res 3840x2160@60
Connection Speed ~76000 Kbps
My router Traffic Analyzer averages at 30KB/s

With any HD title the Current / Optimal Res report 1920x10080@60, and Traffic Analyzer averages 15KB/s.

My conclusion is the 4K content is displayed in 4K resolution but is not HDR formatted as there is no popup badge at the start and the Picture mode on the LG is in SDR.

There have been lots of reported wifi performance issue with this TV, so try to use a wired connection.
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-21, 11:38 PM Thread Starter
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Location: Etobicoke
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BPlayer, I'll try looking those last videos up and see what I can see - so this was pretty much prime time as well from the sounds of it based on your post time. I've been wired to the OLED through the same powered switch to the router that my Xbox records 350+ mbps down on whatever method they use fwiw, so i don't see any issues on my end as far as bandwidth even if it went as far as 100mbps. I keep as many of my devices that are fixed on wired connections as I can.

Hmm, just now at 11:15pm - dynasty warriors started at 2560x1440 but quickly went to 3840x2160 76982Kbps +/- 5Kbps. 0 dropped frames. A developer wants to sue was much lower bit rate but started out at 3840x2160, hiccuped and then went to 2560x1440 at 10-14000kbps only, but recovered to full 4k and 40000-75000 kbps. Lots of variation in connection speed at the same current resolution tho.
Shadow of War bounced up and down at way lower bit rates, mostly 1920x1080 but all the way up to 3840 at times, bit rates between 5000 and 30000 Kbps only... this one was more like what I seem to normally getup of these '4k' videos. As the DF videos are all about comparing video quality the 1080 norm on that one sort of defeats the point a bit. Oh, wait, 6 minutes in I'm up to 80000Kbps 4k on that video and it seems to have finally stabilized at that. Anyway disappointing not to get the quality consistently that I believe I'm paying for, although if it is youtube's end then I'm not really paying for that I guess especially as none of my YouTube apps have ads.

Civuck, I've never seen better than 40 or 50 up on a single connection. When I asked Rogers about the speeds, they did say that the speed was an aggregate. Down I've managed 750-800 on a single wired or wireless on 802.11ac on my newer MacBook, and reached a combined simultaneous well over the 1gbit using a wired+ac at the same time. I can't remember what the combined up was on that test. Also, Orange Is the new Black (4k, no HDR) seems like 15.26 Mbps once it gets up to speed but so does Altered Carbon with 4k + Dolby Vision, so maybe there's not much overhead for setting the HDR levels vs all the bits for 4k. Interestingly when I set up my Harmony One remote for this TV I have an 'Info' button for Netflix that for the life of me I can't find/replicate in any way on the LG tv remote ;-).

Edit/Addendum: Just noticed that the app has a new `Quality` button under More Options tonight that wasn't there before, and you can select the desired quality like on a browser youtube session. It was on 4k (Auto) when I tried that for Shadow of War video, but I could pin it to 2160p 4k and that seemed to hold for as much of my replay of that video as I had tried. On regular Youtube apps I think this is sort of sticky, so maybe I can just pick this and see if the app will continue to deliver it from video to video.

Jethro - LG OLED65C7P, NB 3.0, Yam HTR6190, Polk, Harmony 680, Xbox One X

Last edited by Joxer; 2018-02-21 at 11:47 PM. Reason: Found quality toggle
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-22, 07:31 AM
Join Date: Feb 2004
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Originally Posted by Joxer View Post
Interestingly when I set up my Harmony One remote for this TV I have an 'Info' button for Netflix that for the life of me I can't find/replicate in any way on the LG tv remote ;-).
There is no Info button on the LG remote but you can perform the same function by pointing the mouse at the upper left corner and pressing scroll wheel twice.
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-02-27, 09:14 PM Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Etobicoke
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Hmm, I just tried that Bplayer, but that didn't seem to do anything.

The YouTube performance continues to be very hit or miss, hard to really tie it to any time of day, content etc.

Jethro - LG OLED65C7P, NB 3.0, Yam HTR6190, Polk, Harmony 680, Xbox One X
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 2018-03-06, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2002
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Ah, finally dawned on me BPlayer that you're talking about the info for an input - doesn't work for the LG Apps like it's own Netflix.

Jethro - LG OLED65C7P, NB 3.0, Yam HTR6190, Polk, Harmony 680, Xbox One X
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