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ON - Ottawa, Vanier, Gloucester, Orleans - OTA

588K views 2K replies 301 participants last post by  Whitewulf613 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Getting started.
I live just north of the Racetrack/Casino, Quinn Rd

I have lived with rabbit ears for years and want to upgrade to an outside antenna system for 3 TVs picking up as much UHF and VHF signals as possible to start with. By living with cheap rabbit ears running two TVs for years, I know I will be very happy with the improvements I will have going to a proper outside Anenna system for analog and digital signals.

I have been reading posts for 2 days now to get myself started and I think I have information overload and there are so amny things to consider.

I have gone to TVFOOL to find out channels and locations.
I understand I probably do not want a long distance setup as most station are fairly close.
I am not sure of the antennas I need for my area/use.

Does anyone live near me that has been doing this for a while who can help me get started?

Cheers,
 
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#224 ·
If you think you are also overloading your TV with the Kitz turned all the way up and because there is not much splitting of the signal and not much cable length, you can always add an attenuator before the TV input. Make sure to put the attenuator after your preamp power inserter, or have an attenuator that passes DC power.
 
#225 ·
Attic reception in Orleans (Cumberland): Fieldfair Way?

Right up front I’d like to state that an outdoor antenna is out of the question for me. Therefore, the best next option is to place my antenna in the attic, and I have done that. The following are my results using A Turk (SS clone) with amplifier (near TV). The antenna is placed at the highest point possible in the attic at approximately 24 feet from the ground level.

I get all the digital local channels (six of them):
CBOT (~90%)
CBOFT (~90%)
Sun (~90%)
OMNIHD1 (80%)
OMNIHD2 (70%)
CityTVHD (95%)

And as a bonus I get,

WCEF (one HD and two SD) (~76%)

At night reception improves dramatically for all channels with minimum quality of ~90% for WCEF. I may add that when the power to the amp is off I lose few of my digital channels, including WCEF. My cable run from the attic to the TV is about 60 feet using RG6 cable.
Now here’s my question. Given the information from TVfool (link attached) for my (exact) coordinates, and the good reception using an indoor antenna (Turk) is it reasonable to assume if I were to build diy 4-bay antenna and placed in the attic I will be able to pull in at least one of the US Networks (ABC or CBS), or is what I got know is the limit of what I can get? I’ll appreciate very much your feedback, before I embark on building my own antenna.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id=a3627c775c5c0a
 
#226 ·
Hi and welcome skipticum. I really don't think you will have much hope of receiving WNYF-LP on 18 with an attic mount antenna, especially since your SS clone won't pick up WNPI, which is almost 10dB stronger.

Your results are actually pretty indicative of what TV Fool predicts, saying that WCFE can be received with an attic mount antenna, but WNPI and WNYF-LP may require an outdoor antenna. A better antenna will make WCFE more reliable however, especially in the winter when reception of distant stations gets worse.
 
#266 ·
I built a trial SBGH antenna and placed it in the attic next to the SS clone. Guess what? Now I'm receiving WNPI (physical channel 18) (PBS) clearly and my reception improved a lot across the board. So now I'm wondering if I should get an amplifier hoping to catch CBC and FOX on WNYF-LP.
 
#228 ·
Update

To recap my situation: I’m in a condo on the 12th floor in the market, facing north. I can receive all of the CF stations with a paperclip, but I was getting nothing from HC with an indoor antenna. I tried other options including the Terk SS clone. That got me City-TV 17.1 for couple of weeks, but then would not pick it up again.

I finally invested in the mini state (actually there’s nothing mini about it including the price or the size) on sale from the Source. Now I am able to pick up all 6 digital channels available in Ottawa, including the elusive 66.1 and there’s also a significant improvement in the analogue signals from HC.

I had almost given up on this one too, but was finally able to find the “sweet spot” in my condo. Although from a décor point of view, the spot isn’t very sweet at all. I like the fact that I can rotate the antenna remotely and I need to depending on the station.

One question I have is whether this antenna might be overkill come next September? I mean in post transition will the digital stations increase their ERP and HAAT as per the IC database? And if that’s the case, perhaps I will be able to receive all channels with a smaller antenna.

On the other hand, if that is the case, may be I’ll have more flexibility as to where I could place the mini state, somewhere more discreet.
 
#229 ·
One question I have is whether this antenna might be overkill come next September? I mean in post transition will the digital stations increase their ERP and HAAT as per the IC database?
The numbers in the IC database are maximums and some of them don't even make sense. The HAAT is especially problematic as many stations were listed with an HAAT that is higher than the top of the tower they are broadcasting from. While some stations may increase their power a bit, I figure most will stay the same.

My guess is CBC will increase their HAAT and power and OMNI.2 needs to change channels which will help, but I would guess they will still have the same ERP. I am guessing that CITY and OMNI.1 will stay the same however (though the OMNI's could move up to the top of the tower to share CITY's antenna).
 
#233 · (Edited)
Well the sun popped out this afternoon so back up on the roof I went. I confirmed I am pointing the antenna in a reasonable direction to get WNPI/WCFE.

Of course I still don't get either one of them. Signal strength reached a maximum of 71% but the low was 25% so no lock.

I'm pretty sure the Kitz preamp has failed for some reason so I'm taking it out of the equation. That leaves me with the need for a more sensitive antenna ...
 
#234 · (Edited by Moderator)
Beacon Hill North

I live beside Beacon Hill Shopping Center, at 3rd floor. I made a test on the TVfool and get this result:

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id=a362c778844634

I plan to buy a TV, targeted TV set is Panasonic Plasma 42”.
Would seek help on what antenna is good for me? I see people mention FactoryDirect or Source. I may also get one there. But have no knowledge of what kind of antenna to choose.
Also is the TV set a good one for receive OTA TV channels?
 
#235 ·
welcome vwei1234, I suggest a brand name antenna compared to the clones you'll find at Factory Direct and some other places. The Source will have some antennas, but likely not the best tried and true, best-results models as recorded under the antenna chart here:
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=97121

Then as far as stores are concerned, the only store which you'll find great brand name antennas (from the antenna chart) in stock is in the west end:
http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showpost.php?p=1144738&postcount=737
 
#236 ·
I can't even detect Fox and CBS now:(
Oh well, at least now I know there isn't a black hole directly at my house :)
I'm thrilled to finally see WNPI. Even if I lose it tomorrow, I now know a few upgrades will get me to my goal!

And with the arrival of Netflix our choices get even broader.

Good night!
 
#237 ·
amac, this is a good night. I'm seeing a bit of signal on channels 7, 21 and 41, with the antenna pointing about 40 degrees East of Watertown.

Let's see what happens to WNYF-LD tomorrow morning at 8:30.

-gmd
 
#240 ·
WNYF-LD is still coming in almost at strong. I don't think it will fade at 8:30.

Are they broadcasting at their full 'intended' power?

-gmd
 
#241 ·
Thank you for your help. Flavoie.

I will go there to buy it. Good news for me! I live in apartment, it is not good to dig holes on the wall, better I just put it on the floor. Will it work if I just put it beside the window? which direction is good? At least what are the channels I can get?

Thanks a lot.
 
#244 ·
Amac,

Don't despair, apparently there is a bad ground wire for a radio station which prevents WNYF to be on from now on (and yes, it was at 4 kW when on). They will 'launch' it when it's ready (how? don't know).

On the other hand, you should get WNPI. Are you aiming directly at it?

-gmd
 
#246 · (Edited by Moderator)
Don't despair, apparently there is a bad ground wire for a radio station which prevents WNYF to be on from now on
Despair, no way. I'm still elated that I finally got something from across the border. I simply recognize I need a little booster to stack the odds in my favour.

I did get WNPI this evening with a few dropouts.
I'm puzzled why my PC tuners identify the channel numbers differently than the digital tv's tuner.
 
#245 ·
vwei1234,

I live just up at the top of beacon hill and have been getting plenty of channels:

American:

Norwood PBS always
Plattsburg PBS if I point the antenna Always
ABC HD...~50% of the time
CW SD

Weak (and rare):
Watertown PBS
FOX HD
CBS

Canadian:

CBC english and french HD
City HD
SunTV HD...although dissappointed they stopped carrying CW HD shows
Omni 1 and 2 HD

...just off the top of my head...I may be forgetting something. I havn't bothered with analog but you should be able to get a few more local broadcasters there too.

Point your antenna few degrees west of due south (trial and error here) to see if you can get any of the far off American stations.
 
#248 ·
amac,

what do the channels come up as? Which one is not reporting 28-1, 28-2, 18-1, 18-2 and 18-3?

WNYF-LD physical channel 18, two channels: 28-1 FOX / 28-2 CBS-HD
WNPI-DT physical channel 23, three channels: 18-1 WNPI / 18-2 Create / 18-3 WNPI-HD

-gmd
 
#251 · (Edited)
To answer Roger1818 and GMD
I'm using SaqeTV on my PVR.

However I just realized I got it wrong. The SageTV software reports the channels as expected. It's the TV I'm trying out that has it wrong.
It has WNPI-HD (18.3) coming up as 23-3. It has also registered WNYF-SD as 18.3 and WWNY-HD as 18.4
 
#252 ·
mike,

- WNYF-LD has FOX SD and CBS HD, no FOX HD
- the new "Massena" broadcast *is* WNYF-LD on physical 18, and it near hwy 56 South of Potsdam. If you're not receiving FOX and CBS on physical 18, but rather on physical channel 35, you are getting the original channel WNYF-DT (28 was the physical channel of WNYF-TV - analog). If you're getting CBS HD and Fox (in this order), that WWNY-DT on channel 7...
- WNYF-LD was on one night this week

amac,

- reboot the TV...!
- seriously, a lot of digital tuners get confused after a while, based on mapping errors that occur from time to time. The best way to get back in business is to do a complete scan, which wipes everything as it does so.

-gmd
 
#253 · (Edited by Moderator)
Tenth Line near Blackburn Bypass

Hi all

Lots of good info in this thread.

I have just decided to leave behind Bell TV for an ensemble of OTA, Netflix, torrents and online video services (NHL Gamecenter). Going to be setting up an HTPC to bring it all together.

http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id=a362b076d4a39f

The setting looks good for receiving the new transmitter that has been discussed here.

Any thoughts? Best antenna equipment? I do not want a tower in the ground in the background - I think I am limited to a tripod on the roof.

Thanks in advance.
 
#254 ·
Welcome kobayashi. You certainly are in a good location with regards to signal strength. The biggest issue you are going to have (and it is a common problem) is how to receive signals from towers in different directions. If you are lucky the locals will be strong enough to be receivable by an antenna pointed towards WNPI/WNYF.

As for a recommended antenna, I think your best bet would be a Winegard PR-8800 as its net gain below channel 35 is second to none (for receiving 18 and 23) and with careful aiming you might be able to get its side and rear lobes pointed towards Herberts Corners and Camp Fortune. You will also need a VHF antenna to receive Global and CTV..
 
#255 ·
roger,

The Winegard PR-8800 is discontinued, and replaced with the HD-8800. As we all saw a difference between the Channel Master 4228 vs the newer 4228HD, is this HD version just a rebadge or was there a redesign for it ?

Also, the PR or HD 8800 does not appear in the Antenna chart even though i agree it's got very nice gain on the channels we currently have in the region.

Gain-wise, I've seen the hdtvprimer net gain chart for the PR-8800, but when you compare with the net gain chart of a 4228HD hacked, the 4228HD is better in this channel range, actually pretty much the whole range...
 
#274 ·
Gain-wise, I've seen the hdtvprimer net gain chart for the PR-8800, but when you compare with the net gain chart of a 4228HD hacked, the 4228HD is better in this channel range, actually pretty much the whole range...
I have been thinking about how to respond to this for a bit now and although the theoretical net gain for a modified 4228HD is better in this channel range, I believe those simulations were assuming optimal modifications. In reality, when hacking an antenna the results will be less than optimal, reducing the gain by 0.5 to 1.0 dB, making it very comparable to the 8800. I personally would rather recommend a stock antenna than hacking one to make it work properly, but that is just me.

Also, the PR or HD 8800 does not appear in the Antenna chart
As Stampeder said, he will be adding it back to the antenna chart. He had told me this privately before I sent out this recommendation.
 
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